PvP: Rank the classes!

[Wo|2M]

I realize that this thread could draw a lot of trolls and flames, but I think it would be interesting to see what people think. Here is the premise:

Rank your *opinion* on PvP classes according to tiers; because there are tiers and not outright ranks, you can have multiple classes at the same tier. You choose where the breaks are. Assume that the classes are played well, and that they are ideally specced for PvP (not going to mention equipment, assume that noone has anything special).

Feel free to post explainations on why you put what class where. But please keep this post constructive and positive. I'll start with my own.

Tier 1:
Priest (Shadow's are an obvious favorite)
Shaman (mail + totems+whirlwind+shocks)
Rogue(insane burst damage, leather armor, stealth)

Tier 2:
Mage (Fire mage+poly+frostnova= death)
Warrior(Overpower,MS,intercept, Recklessness)

Tier 3:
Warlock(DoT's, fear, succy, but not enough burst damage to compensate for cloth)
Druid (can tank and heal, but DPS is among the worst),

Tier 4:
Hunter (out-damaged by most casters and tough to get out of melee range against melee. Pet is not half as useful as it is in PvE),
Paladin(Bubble, heals and SoC. If SoC procs, Paladins get bumped up to at least tier 3. If it doesn't, pallies base DPS is perhaps the worst in the game. Even two lives doesn't make up poor melee and zero ranged. Very kiteable)


I realize that I may have offended those on the lower half of the list, but all arguements are welcome.

Discuss!

[Thelorax]

I realize that this thread could draw a lot of trolls and flames, but I think it would be interesting to see what people think. Here is the premise:

Rank your *opinion* on PvP classes according to tiers; because there are tiers and not outright ranks, you can have multiple classes at the same tier. You choose where the breaks are. Assume that the classes are played well, and that they are ideally specced for PvP (not going to mention equipment, assume that noone has anything special).

Feel free to post explainations on why you put what class where. But please keep this post constructive and positive. I'll start with my own.

Tier 1:
Priest (Shadow's are an obvious favorite)
Shaman (mail + totems+whirlwind+shocks)
Rogue(insane burst damage, leather armor, stealth)

Tier 2:
Mage (Fire mage+poly+frostnova= death)
Warrior(Overpower,MS,intercept, Recklessness)

Tier 3:
Warlock(DoT's, fear, succy, but not enough burst damage to compensate for cloth)
Druid (can tank and heal, but DPS is among the worst),

Tier 4:
Hunter (out-damaged by most casters and tough to get out of melee range against melee. Pet is not half as useful as it is in PvE),
Paladin(Bubble, heals and SoC. If SoC procs, Paladins get bumped up to at least tier 3. If it doesn't, pallies base DPS is perhaps the worst in the game. Even two lives doesn't make up poor melee and zero ranged. Very kiteable)


I realize that I may have offended those on the lower half of the list, but all arguements are welcome.

Discuss!

Good post.

I have to counter on just a few points.

Hunter: a marksmanship spec'd hunter can exceed a caster on DPS (I think)... but yeah, the trick is keeping the bastages out of melee and keeping the kiting going.

Rogues are pushovers if you can get the drop on them, but yeah... if they surprise you you'll either have to die or run away.

I have trouble ranking them because I think so much depends on the player. A crappy player can be very successful with a rogue, but would be terrible with a warlock, hunter, or maybe a druid.

All those Tier 1 classes have a lower learning curve,.

[northernlights]

Group PVP:

1. Mage
2. Warlock (properly played/specced)
3. Warrior (fury)
4. Priest (shadow)
5. Shaman
6. Druid
7. Hunter
8. Rogue
9. Paladin

1 vs. 1 PVP

1. Shaman
2. Druid
3. Priest (shadow)
4. Warlock
5. Rogue
6. Hunter
7. Mage
8. Warrior
9. Paladin

[Nezzaraji]

Are you serious a lower learning curve for a Priest? Come on.

[AsylumOfNight]

I had the hardest time figuring out how to properly use my shadow priest. But once I did I sure can do a lot of damage quickly. Now I find that I am either left alone or ganged up on by lvl 60s. I would have to say that rogues are the hardest for me to fight against with the stealth and stun. Anything that can heal themselves are tough to go up against as well as those that can run around you in circles while hitting you at the same time. Other than that I can't get more specific in a list ... haven't pvp'd enough to form a good opinion. (Been too busy trying to get to lvl 60)

[Wo|2M]

Group PVP:

1. Mage
2. Warlock (properly played/specced)
3. Warrior (fury)
4. Priest (shadow)
5. Shaman
6. Druid
7. Hunter
8. Rogue
9. Paladin

1 vs. 1 PVP

1. Shaman
2. Druid
3. Priest (shadow)
4. Warlock
5. Rogue
6. Hunter
7. Mage
8. Warrior
9. Paladin

An interesting (and somewhat obvious, d'oh!) idea. I guess I had 1v1 PvP in mind, but feel free to answer as you see fit. This was intentionally open-ended.

Pallies seem to be consistently near the bottom, with mages and priests usually near the top. Once again, PvP very situational, but the object is to see beyond gear or the man/woman behind the keyboard, and at the strengths and weaknesses of each of the classes in their purest PvP form.

Good stuff so far :happy34:

[northernlights]

An interesting (and somewhat obvious, d'oh!) idea. I guess I had 1v1 PvP in mind, but feel free to answer as you see fit. This was intentionally open-ended.

Pallies seem to be consistently near the bottom, with mages and priests usually near the top. Once again, PvP very situational, but the object is to see beyond gear or the man/woman behind the keyboard, and at the strengths and weaknesses of each of the classes in their purest PvP form.

Good stuff so far :happy34:

I would go so far as to say Pallies are the best class vs. inexperienced players. If your not keeping track of their timers (hey wait!!! does that require skill? or just time played?) they can dance with any class all day.

[Euro-Crash]

I would go so far as to say Pallies are the best class vs. inexperienced players. If your not keeping track of their timers (hey wait!!! does that require skill? or just time played?) they can dance with any class all day.

Some people use mod's that actually track the cooldowns of spells. If they are I would say it takes neither skill nor experience. However, if they are playing the way I do this becomes an instinct. :D

[northernlights]

Some people use mod's that actually track the cooldowns of spells. If they are I would say it takes neither skill nor experience. However, if they are playing the way I do this becomes an instinct. :D

Didn't know that. I'm running most of the Insomniax recomp. as it is and it chugs huge amounts of RAM.. no room for more mods, I guess I'l have to keep counting down from 30 in my head. =)

[Euro-Crash]

Didn't know that. I'm running most of the Insomniax recomp. as it is and it chugs huge amounts of RAM.. no room for more mods, I guess I'l have to keep counting down from 30 in my head. =)

Aye. I do so love my Insomniax Recompilation. I also am enamored with my 1GB of RAM :D

I have found little difficulty in taking paladins down 1v1. If it is a group of them...then I usually "Run For The Hills" (Iron Maiden).

[Phil]

My ranking as very dependant on if the classes know how to actually use their character, which throws the rank off of what might commonly be higher in Ranks. I am also assuming Killing Power only as compared to usefulness for healing, because then suddenly a good priest or druid in AV rates high for a 5 man team.

Group PVP:

1. Mage
2. Shaman
3. Warlock
4. Warrior
5. Druid
6. Hunter
7. Priest
8. Rogue
9. Paladin

1 vs. 1 PVP

1. Warlock
2. Shaman
3. Warrior(31/20 MS)
4. Druid
5. Priest
6. Rogue
7. Mage
8. Paladin
9. Hunter

My rankings for Group PvP are that way based on Flag carrying capabilities, ability to assist, and raw killing power. The only things that I have seen Paladin really excell at in WSG is either flag carrying or assisting the carrier. Its sad, I really do hope they get some love. Although I think that Mages get an unfair number of HKs because of their AoE attacks, that is how their class works can't downgrade them for that.

1v1 PvP is a much different story. The warlock has a lot of trick up his sleave, including fear, insane life, the ability to shield/heal/recast minions during battle(depending on spec), the highest AoE damage in the game(although obviously more useful in Mass PvP, and sad that the lock also take damage), and the ability to Seduce, amoung many many others. Only cloth class that has a realistic chance of constant victory against a rogue who sneaks up on them.
Shaman, need I say more?
Warriors, with the ability to close the gap during battle, become fear immune, hamstring so you cannot run, wear plate so melee attacks bounce off like butter knives, prevent you from making any giant heals, disarm, and almost gaurantee themselves a win if you hit 20% life, they are a very very strong class in PvP.
I have a rogue significantly lower than most people because most of their kills come from cloth wearing classes. My main is a warrior and I have found that rogues around my level have a very very difficult time beating me even when they get the jump, just can't do enough damage fast enough, and can't restealth once I have hit them.
I put hunters in the last position because for single PvP, they can put out a lot of damage, but if the gap is closed vs a melee character they are SOL.

All the classes can be fantastic depending on the player, but my rankings assume that each character is played by an expert for that character.

phil

[NocturneNight]

I base my rankings for group PvP on Alterac Valley, and they go like this:

Group PVP:

1. Hunter
2. Mage
3. Warlock
4. Priest
5. Shaman
6. Warrior
7. Rogue
8. Druid
9. Paladin

Hunter stays on top because of their crazy range and sustained DPS. During my time in AV I have yet to see a more lethal class. Gaurded by rogues/warriors and healers, these guys can bring down armies. The hunter's strenght is that once he has taken aim on something he won't let go. He will crit for insane damage, he will multishot and even aoe (to some extent); but the hunters true strengh is his survivability and stubborness. He's mana won't go out, and even if it does he can still shoot. Couple this with his range and you have the best ranger in the game, imo.

Mage comes second because of heavy damage and aoe. But I don't think they can last as long as a hunter, nor be as destructive over the same amount of time. Hunters just outlast mages.

I used to cut through warlocks like butter, but I feel they have gotten stronger with every patch released (ok this is not true, but generally the warlock players have become much better overall at using their class). If they are specced the right way they can do insane shadow damage, and have a much higher hp than any other class.

The reason I put shamans so far down the list is because I don't feel they are all that useful in group. They don't have mage aoe, and they don't have hunter range or warlock/priest damage. They have the almighty windfury, chain healing and totems. All of these are good aspects for group pvp, but they are not the best.

I base my 1on1-list from experience in the world, getting the jump and getting jumped, and close encounters in WSG.

1on1 PVP:

1. Shaman
2. Rogue
3. Priest
4. Hunter
5. Mage
6. Warlock
7. Warrior
8. Druid
9. Paladin

Shaman is obvious, they are overpowered 1on1. Everyone knows this.

The reason I put Rogue over Priest is that I don't generally have problems with them, let alone mages. I do huge burst damage to them, and if you fear me, 1 second later my trinket breaks that fear and you are already severly injured and crippled ( if not dead alreadt, using the devout set which has very high spirit you are not going to last long). A good hunter will get me every time.

As for the other classes; I don't really know, so don't pay to much attention to the ranks. I know a good warrior can pretty much kill anything. Hunter/Mage is a very close call. But if the hunter is absolutely 100% on top of his game, he will win.


I put hunters in the last position because for single PvP, they can put out a lot of damage, but if the gap is closed vs a melee character they are SOL.


Don't tell me hunter sucks because if you do, then obviously you have never met a good one. I had no problems taking down rogues or warriors with my hunters, even if they where higher level.

[Phil]

in 1v1 PvP, Hunters have nothing on warriors, sorry to say. If a warrior starts the battle with a charge-> hamstring, hunter has lost. If they switch to intercept-> hamstring, hunter has lost. If you dodge a single attack, and overpower becomes availible, odds are, hunter lost. I am not trying to suggest that hunters are bad, I am just saying that a well played warrior shouldnt have trouble against a well played hunter.

phil

[Praxis]

Is this kind of rating even useful? Seems kinda pointless to me.

In 1v1 all classes have their weaknesses and strengths, they can kill certain classes easily, but will struggle against others. That's the nature of a class system, paper > rock > scissors > paper. The system isn't perfectly balanced I agree but I don't think there's an overall strongest class (no, it's not shaman).

In group PvP it's all about good group composition, the combination of skills different classes can bring to effectively counter the skills of the other group. Again, you can't say one class is overall stronger than the rest, because there will always be a counter that will beat them. And even with a 'sub optimal' group good communication, discipline and leadership can often win the day against more disorganized opponents. (which is why most WSG matches tend to be walk overs for one side or the other).

[Jachyra]

I am really surprised people ranked shaman so high and warrior so low.

[NocturneNight]

in 1v1 PvP, Hunters have nothing on warriors, sorry to say. If a warrior starts the battle with a charge-> hamstring, hunter has lost. If they switch to intercept-> hamstring, hunter has lost. If you dodge a single attack, and overpower becomes availible, odds are, hunter lost. I am not trying to suggest that hunters are bad, I am just saying that a well played warrior shouldnt have trouble against a well played hunter.

phil

Wing Clip, Scatter Shot, Deterrence & Counter-attack, FD and place frost trap... I'm sorry, but a good warrior have no chance versus a good hunter. :winky47:

(I realise that. It's just that many hunters are bad. If a hunter is played skillfully he can be very dangerous in 1on1 pvp. I killed wars with 1h +shield, I killed them with 2hand, I killed them in duels..)

[Thelorax]

Wing Clip, Scatter Shot, Deterrence & Counter-attack, FD and place frost trap... I'm sorry, but a good warrior have no chance versus a good hunter. :winky47:

(I realise that. It's just that many hunters are bad. If a hunter is played skillfully he can be very dangerous in 1on1 pvp. I killed wars with 1h +shield, I killed them with 2hand, I killed them in duels..)

damn... why didn't I ever think of that FD, frost trap bit :P


<---- not the best hunter :(

[northernlights]

I am really surprised people ranked shaman so high and warrior so low.

Good PVP warriors are not a dime a dozen. I can toy with most warriors I face in battle (as a Frost Mage) , but there are 2 or 3 warriors on my server, proprely specced with almost complete might sets that literally chase me around warsong gulch.

So its a tough call to make, whether your speaking of general experience or a 'worst case scenario'.

[mlakrid]

I am really surprised people ranked shaman so high and warrior so low.

I wont give my In-game name... but I play a shaman, and Im here to tell you, I dont fear ANY class... we are overpowered...

I would like to make 1 point however... the shaman was made to counter the paladin...

So instead of 3 lives... he has MASS DMG... I have a friend running one of the mods which tabulates the information on DMG, kills etc in the background and me at 48th and his mage at 51st.. were in a ZF group...

He only outdamaged me by 13k (He was first) and had LESS kills than I did (I was first)... and we get to wear mail... imbalanced in PVP.. YES...

Imbalanced for faction GROUP PVP? Definately NOT....

Reason: TOTEMS....... they DO NOT STACK.... simple as that...

If I had 5 shaman in a group we could all drop str totems and we still ony get one... or even if they wanted to limit it... they could make it to where only mana/health totems stack, but blizz already said they wont....

PLUS.... on my server Lightnings Blade.... we were outnumbered by 4 to 1 until very recently now its probably only 2 to 1...

[mlakrid]

Good PVP warriors are not a dime a dozen. I can toy with most warriors I face in battle (as a Frost Mage) , but there are 2 or 3 warriors on my server, proprely specced with almost complete might sets that literally chase me around warsong gulch.

So its a tough call to make, whether your speaking of general experience or a 'worst case scenario'.

With the new patch in place a good protection Warr will eat you if he is wearing a shield...

Silence + Intercept = VERY dead caster....

[northernlights]

With the new patch in place a good protection Warr will eat you if he is wearing a shield...

Silence + Intercept = VERY dead caster....

Warriors can silence from range now?

Blink has always been a sufficient answer to charge/intercept.

[Lowkey]

I wont give my In-game name... but I play a shaman, and Im here to tell you, I dont fear ANY class... we are overpowered...


Finally, a shaman thats not affraid to say it. Now, in defense of hunters, I do fantastic in 1 on 1 and group pvp in our current state. But, I want everyone to know that I want you all to keep saying we suck. Why, because sooner or later, blizzard is going to take hunters, and make us so strong, it will cause much hate against all of us. I dont know if paladins are saying the same thing, but I would assume that they have high hopes for whatever changes that are in store for them in the near future as well. :happy34:

[northernlights]

Finally, a shaman thats not affraid to say it. Now, in defense of hunters, I do fantastic in 1 on 1 and group pvp in our current state. But, I want everyone to know that I want you all to keep saying we suck. Why, because sooner or later, blizzard is going to take hunters, and make us so strong, it will cause much hate against all of us. I dont know if paladins are saying the same thing, but I would assume that they have high hopes for whatever changes that are in store for them in the near future as well. :happy34:

LOL @ 'A shaman thats not afraid to say it', while that same shaman who fears NO class wont give us his character name... hmmm. I'm sure if you did give up your name I could find a shadow priest that could school you six ways from sunday.

In response to you, Lowkey Hunters are excellent at PVP but like warlocks the majority of them... well, suck. Kiting is not easy, particularly when some of your shots can be taken on the fly while others require you to be standing still.

I don't think Hunters are broken, but their certainly not underpowered.

[Praxis]

Yeah, I'm slightly skeptical about his claims especially as he doesn't mention his talent spec at all, and any shaman should know that makes a huge difference in how the class plays.

Shaman are pretty overpowed in the mid levels (just like rogues and paladins), but after that it goes downhill fast, especially when people get to 60 with completed talent builds and decent gear. Warriors for example suck until 60 but they're pvp monsters with good end game gear.

[Wo|2M]

Stay on subject please. More ranking, less "class X sux/pwns joo". :happy34:

[TheImp]

...The warlock has a lot of trick up his sleave...the highest AoE damage in the game

phil

Actually Mage flame strike and improved arcan explosion do more AoE damage per second, niehter is channeled and neither damages the mage.

As some of the other posters have said no one class is best at everything. As a mage I find some classes to quite easy to beat and others are a pain in the but. My priest friend however has a different list of hard and easy to defeat classes.

It's the nature of the beast. Anything less would be shallow and booring.

Oh, and in response to the poster that said mages got lots of HK for AoE damage that's only partially correct. Doing a little damage to a lot of targets does get you a lot of HKs, but not a lot of contribution points. From what I've seen the classes are pretty well balanced in their ability to gather contribution points.

[Wriam]

Wow - everyone thinks paladins suck in pvp. I can understand why, but geez.

I play a paladin in Dragonmaw, and I do reasonably well in pvp. Then again, I have a full range of manufactured buffs (i.e. potions,sharpening stones, ect.) and a full specc in engineering. I also decided to stick with holy shock. Absolutely worthless for PvE, but it adds a nice damadge bonus in pvp situations. Best part about all of this is that people don't expect me to whip out a thorium grenade, a battle chicken, and a mithril dragonling in a matter of 2 seconds.

I go through this litany to show that paladins can be properly specced for pvp - though even with all these buffs I only win about 80% of the time against my own level.

See you gameside.

[MuTTy_Hc]

Finally, a shaman thats not affraid to say it. Now, in defense of hunters, I do fantastic in 1 on 1 and group pvp in our current state. But, I want everyone to know that I want you all to keep saying we suck. Why, because sooner or later, blizzard is going to take hunters, and make us so strong, it will cause much hate against all of us. I dont know if paladins are saying the same thing, but I would assume that they have high hopes for whatever changes that are in store for them in the near future as well. :happy34:

shamans only overpower noobs who don't understand the shaman class, once you get it down and understand what a shaman can and cannot do, they're really not too much trouble. At least from my experience.

[theRogue]

can i say one thing
rogues arent push overs if you get the jump on them
if you've beaten rogues jsut because u got the jump they didnt know what there were doing a good stun locker can control the battle either way

oh and i think that priests are under estimated for there pvp skills and more priests should become shadow even though they wont get to many groups

[Baboon]

Finally, a shaman thats not affraid to say it. Now, in defense of hunters, I do fantastic in 1 on 1 and group pvp in our current state. But, I want everyone to know that I want you all to keep saying we suck. Why, because sooner or later, blizzard is going to take hunters, and make us so strong, it will cause much hate against all of us. I dont know if paladins are saying the same thing, but I would assume that they have high hopes for whatever changes that are in store for them in the near future as well. :happy34:

I have some really humiliating experiences with hunters below my level using my rogue, being catched in traps or just outrun and shot down. But then again, I have also humilated hunters with higher level than me. I think skill and luck are pretty important.

[DrunkCajun]

I really don't think there are easy ways to rank classes in PvP--it's all fairly relative to what class you play.

For example, as a warlock, I can say that the classes I have the most trouble with are priests and rogues. Even moreso when I'm pitted against both at the same time. Just about any other class I can handle without trouble, and usually I can even handle a priest or rogue without much trouble. The only times in PvP I really have a tough time are when I'm faced with multiple opponents. That's usually a guaranteed death for me, but I can take down one or two with me.

With my warrior, though, the classes that give me the worst time are warlocks, priests, and mages. All of them have some way or another of keeping me away from them (fear/seduce/frost nova), and that renders me worthless.

By the way, I'm not surprised at some of the comments I'm seeing about warlocks, though I have to say that it's clear to me that most people have never met a well-played warlock.

No burst damage? Puh-leeze.

Seduce-->Curse of Shadow-->ShadowBolt (my 58 'lock has critted for ~1800 a dozen times, usually hits for between 800 and 1400)-->Seduce--->Shadowbolt-->Soulburn (instant 700ish damage, crits for 1200+). If that don't take em down, I got plenty of other fun tricks up my sleeve, but those are a good start.

[NocturneNight]

I really don't think there are easy ways to rank classes in PvP--it's all fairly relative to what class you play.

For example, as a warlock, I can say that the classes I have the most trouble with are priests and rogues. Even moreso when I'm pitted against both at the same time. Just about any other class I can handle without trouble, and usually I can even handle a priest or rogue without much trouble. The only times in PvP I really have a tough time are when I'm faced with multiple opponents. That's usually a guaranteed death for me, but I can take down one or two with me.

With my warrior, though, the classes that give me the worst time are warlocks, priests, and mages. All of them have some way or another of keeping me away from them (fear/seduce/frost nova), and that renders me worthless.

By the way, I'm not surprised at some of the comments I'm seeing about warlocks, though I have to say that it's clear to me that most people have never met a well-played warlock.

No burst damage? Puh-leeze.

Seduce-->Curse of Shadow-->ShadowBolt (my 58 'lock has critted for ~1800 a dozen times, usually hits for between 800 and 1400)-->Seduce--->Shadowbolt-->Soulburn (instant 700ish damage, crits for 1200+). If that don't take em down, I got plenty of other fun tricks up my sleeve, but those are a good start.

Yeah as a Rogue I hold the Warlock as the hardest caster to beat. Hunters generally give me more trouble, Shamans are tough but.. I've killed many shamans. I can't say the same thing about Warlocks.

[spymoose]

You can't really rank because even with "for-sure wins" there are people well-geared that really know their class that just don't lose to that stereotype. For example, it's supposed to be assumed that Rogues get crushed by Warriors. Well this is true in many cases but it also is dependent on gear, skill and experience. Some classes have limitations but they can be overcome. When I used to play my Priest I'd run into this one Pally that I just couldn't easily beat, the rest were cake. This chick would crit for me 1k+ and with that kind of damage and her defensive skills it was 50/50 for me.

Druids are the same. Someone who doesn't know what they're doing can make this class look retarded. However, someone skilled and geared decently can take any class in the game consistently, while their hardest opponent is a well-played Warlock (but like I said, this isn't a for-sure loss for all)

[Amyss]

I p\/\//\/ j00, /\/ 3 \/\/ |3

[Eiger]

here's my list -

Group PVP - primarily WSG:

1. Mage
2. Shaman/Warlock
3. Priest
4. Warrior
5. Rogue
6. Druid
7. Hunter
8. Paladin

I didn't bother with 1 on 1 cuz I rarely bother with duels.

I play a warrior as you can see from my sig. So my ratings are based on that perspective.

Mages? Their freeze, blink and sheep are annoying, but mostly they manage to get too far away despite intercept and then crit me. A good one kills me in 10 secs. Mana shield and there always seems to be a priest around to shield them as well. Ability to hang back from the fight and aoe results in high hks for them. Even if I get a jump I lose - need at least 2 to bring them down.

Warlocks and Shamans - seem about equal in ownage to me. Instant casts, pets, melee, totems, dots - very effective directly and in support. Warlocks are harder to solo take down than shamen, but easier for a group due to lower hit points and armor.

Priests mostly have the 15 second shield, fear and run away for aid so they're hard to kill - I just try not to get suckered into following them. Whenever I find them in the middle of the action I go after them hoping someone will join in so we can take them down - but I play on alliance so there's few watching for those strategic sorts of things or watching others' backs, hehe.

That's it for classes I really can't take on alone unless the player sucks.

I've gotten to where I can take out rogues a little more than half the time unless they're really good and get the jump on me. If they stunlock me im in trouble obviously. And they tend to travel in pairs. But they tend to go down faster than most - they're fragile thankfully. If you can gang up on them they're easy. They might get away if they vanish though.

Druids can be difficult to kill - mainly cuz they heal up, switch to travel form and run. Otherwise they're mine.

Hunters can be a problem if well played and its one on one. But usually, they are shooting at something else and I charge and they keep shooting at that something else like a fool while I kill them. Pets are only annoying when they chase me down, otherwise I ignore them.

Paladins - beats me - I'm alliance - but seem best to me as a decoy for others to attack while the rest of us focus fire.

[Gaudion]

If I take anything away from this thread it'll be an increased disdain for people who use mods to bolster their PvP performance. Lame. Lame, lame, lame.

[Tufriast]

LOL @ 'A shaman thats not afraid to say it', while that same shaman who fears NO class wont give us his character name... hmmm. I'm sure if you did give up your name I could find a shadow priest that could school you six ways from sunday.

In response to you, Lowkey Hunters are excellent at PVP but like warlocks the majority of them... well, suck. Kiting is not easy, particularly when some of your shots can be taken on the fly while others require you to be standing still.

I don't think Hunters are broken, but their certainly not underpowered.

Shamans are donions. As in, done. They are perfect. Every other class has some refining for sure in PVP.

Shadow Priests on -my- server have issues taking down Shamans. The guides here on Worldofwar.net state Shamans are a Shadow Priests worst nightmare. This might not be the case with the new VE coming down. Taking one on in non-shadow form doesn't seem appealing, but is an effective way to out last a shaman. Start with silence, start blasting, dot, flay, fear, run, blast, heal yourself, and kite them is my solution. It's proved ok as a Shadow Priest.

[Snugglz]

Sigh...I keep seeing warriors on the lower end of the spectrum and this upsets me. All I hvae to say for 1v1 is : Intercept+enraged ms+ retalliation = PWNED GG THX NO RE NUB! If you can survive onslaughts like this you deffinitly deserve a cookie. So to everyone who thinks warriors are bad at pvp you are very mistaken. I'll admit you don't see a lot of warriors owning everything in pvp. This is because most warriors don't know what their doing and they still think they are a "Click and sit" class like on most other mmo's.So i'll see you bleeding on the battlefield guys! :bigclap: :bigclap:

[northernlights]

Sigh...I keep seeing warriors on the lower end of the spectrum and this upsets me. All I hvae to say for 1v1 is : Intercept+enraged ms+ retalliation = PWNED GG THX NO RE NUB! If you can survive onslaughts like this you deffinitly deserve a cookie. So to everyone who thinks warriors are bad at pvp you are very mistaken. I'll admit you don't see a lot of warriors owning everything in pvp. This is because most warriors don't know what their doing and they still think they are a "Click and sit" class like on most other mmo's.So i'll see you bleeding on the battlefield guys! :bigclap: :bigclap:

Heres the thing about a level 60 PVP warrior.

5-15 man instance gear or less - worst PVP class
Raid gear or PVP gear above rank 10 - best PVP class.

Warriors are cake for casters until they start getting that + resist gear... but casting at the geared out ones is typically - resist, resist, hit, resist, hit, resist, resist.

So... learn which warriors on (opposite faction) your server have this gear as you really need to fight them differently.

[Snugglz]

Heres the thing about a level 60 PVP warrior.

5-15 man instance gear or less - worst PVP class
Raid gear or PVP gear above rank 10 - best PVP class.

Warriors are cake for casters until they start getting that + resist gear... but casting at the geared out ones is typically - resist, resist, hit, resist, hit, resist, resist.

So... learn which warriors on (opposite faction) your server have this gear as you really need to fight them differently.

You make it sound like I was bashing warriors >.<

[sarangani]

Interesting that pallys fall so far down the lists in general - on my server, most of the top ranked pvp Alliance players are paladins.

I play rogue and I have the most trouble with priests 1v1 if they are played well, and other rogues too if they get the first opener and keep me stunlocked. We're glass cannons - given things our own way we can do serious damage very fast - but once we are jumped we die equally quickly. 1v1 I can usually survive with my stuns and clever use of blinding powder, but of course I don't get 1v1 fights very often and once I become visible I get ganked, usually ending up with about 10 spells on me!

Oh, and I can beat warriors in duels without problems if my abilities aren't on cooldown - maybe I haven't met a good warrior yet!

[Schnorres]

I play a rogue with ~4400 hp unbuffed (blue AP/STA gear).

When playing in Warsong Gulch I can beat any class 1:1 easily, if they are not rank 10+ full buffed with highend epic stuff or just "run" away.

Tier 1:
Mage
Shaman

Tier 2:
Priest
Rogue

Tier 3:
Warrior
Warlock
Druid
Hunter
Paladin

[DrunkCajun]

sarangani--on my server Pallies are indeed some of the highest-ranked. Played well Pallies can be amazing. The proportion of well-played pallies to piss-poor pallies is such a miniscule decimal that I'd need scientific notation to properly express it, and since I can't read or write scientific notation, overlooking them is easier. :happy05:

[toader]

I find it hilarious that warlocks are ranked all OVER the place on everyones lists.

Obviously, the only right ones are the ones with warlocks at the very bottom.

We suck.

[AeroJonesy]

I find it hilarious that warlocks are ranked all OVER the place on everyones lists.


Same with druids. All I've gathered from this thread is that good players are going to beat bad players regardless of class. And people from Blizz probably stop by and read this, and smile, because everyone's got the classes all over the place.

[toader]

Same with druids. All I've gathered from this thread is that good players are going to beat bad players regardless of class. And people from Blizz probably stop by and read this, and smile, because everyone's got the classes all over the place.Yea, smile that youve balanced every class but Shaman.

Then cry as you see Shaman in the top 1-3 in everyones lists. :happy34:

[Aerath]

If reports were honour kills, I'd so be getting my rank up ! :wink2:

[Snugglz]

If reports were honour kills, I'd so be getting my rank up ! :wink2:

Same here :(

[toader]

Did posts # 47 and 48 make sense to anyone?

[DrunkCajun]

Did posts # 47 and 48 make sense to anyone?

They shouldn't because what was once post #47 was deleted by me this morning. Spammer came in here and buried an ad post, which I zapped. Aerath was one of those who reported it.

[toader]

They shouldn't because what was once post #47 was deleted by me this morning. Spammer came in here and buried an ad post, which I zapped. Aerath was one of those who reported it.AAhhhhkkhaaa!!!

Weilding your power for Aeval again are you?

[Bje]

I group pvp i know, pallies aint of that much use. But in 1v1 i have no problem whatsoever beating any class. the only time i die by hordies is if im ganged up on, or by some x lvls higher than me, im 48 now.. BUT, if the hordie decides to run, he's gone.. :) ..

Not to say that im so extremely good :), but still..

And shamans is not the most difficult class to beat, deffinately not.. i can pretty much rely on SoC to proc at least once every fight, but i still think its a little annoying that its so unreliable..

When i was 47, questing in hinterlands with a (lousy) 43 pallie, we met a 47 shaman and a 48 rogue.. i jumped in and ganked them both, while the 43 pallie healed me..
We then left and continued questing, and they surprised us (we both had full health), the rogue sapped me, and they easily killed the 43.. at that moment i never thought id have much of a chance, but the shaman was killed in an instant after 2 procs of SoC, and i barely managed to kill the rogue, it was VERY close though..

Could be we just met 2 bad players, but that said, i think pallies is one of the best in 1v1 (suck in group pvp), as long as the horde doesnt try to run, cus i could never catch anyone :) (sometimes my Gnomish Net-o-Matic projector is of great use though)

Its seems as, when you're ranking classes, you depend on the pallie being a lousy player, while the others are normal, or good players..

I actually noticed early on that my pallie was great for duels, cus there's no running away while duelling.. :)

[Snugglz]

Did posts # 47 and 48 make sense to anyone?

I got suspended for 3 days again. I don't know about aerath but thats the only reason i've been posting a lot on forums lately.

[Scorch_Hellfire]

im a warlock so i know:

1. shamans
2. rogues
3. mages

etc.

9. warlocks

why? cuz we are the weakest class in the game and blizz keeps ignoring it... it doesnt matter if we have fear... lots of times i get the crap beat out of me before i can even get a spell off... especially against stunning classes... plus other classes have better fear than ours... like priests... instant cast aoe fear ftw... not only that but theres tons of ways to break fear now... like those damn trinkets they sell u at RANK 2... wtf... but anyways yeah... and since were cloth we are easy prey to ANY other class... the only classes we have a chance against are... priests... and... priests... why not mages?... cuz every single horde mage that ive ever had the unpleasant experience to meet just spams arcane explosion until everyone around him is obliterated... and since its instant theyve also chased me down with it... even if we do get a fear off... diminishing returns pretty much sabotages any hope of doing it long enough to make a difference...besides one player isnt that much anyways... and howl of terror has a freaking 2 min cool down so we cant use that more than once in a big fight... and since were cloth wearers we basically have giant bullseyes on us to meleers... i know when all those horde rogues and warriors see us they are like "AHG CLOTH WEARER! FREE HONOR! MUST KILL!" shamans too... cuz theyre damn earthshock screws us over 3 fold in a split second... not only does it do a massive amount of damage even when it doesnt crit... it interupts spell casting and silences for like 5 seconds... which is a long time in the middle of a pvp battle to be incapacitated... and on top of that its instant... wtf were blizzard thinking when they made this spell so damn good... seriously... if ur a cloth wearer and ur running down the middle of wsg and u see a couple of shamans coming in ur direction... u might as well say gg and either run and hide or just accept that theyre going to kill u within seconds... just like rogues do...

[DrunkCajun]

Well...um...no. I'm going to have to disagree.

As someone who consistently leads the kill count in WSG runs, I disagree with you Scorch. Yes, we die. It happens. Yes, there are classes that are hard to fight (I find Mages, Shaman and Rogues to be at the top of that list).

No, we are not incredibly weak characters. Not in the least. In fact, I find the notion pretty amusing.

We cannot just charge into a fray like other classes. The best strategy I've found in WSG is to play midfield, and attack others while they are distracted. DoTs don't do a ton of damage, and often in the heat of battle folks don't even notice they've been slapped with them. Often, so focused on trying to drop that warrior they're fighting, they don't realize that I've dropped them both to 25% life until a quick shadowbolt/shadowburn combo drops one and another shadowbolt and few hits from my succy drops the other before they can get to me.

If my warlock is charged by a group, or faced with close-quarters combat with more than 1, I'm toast. In those cases, in fact, I usually just DoT the players (in case another member of my team is nearby to take them down), and /dance with them as they destroy me. If I can lurk back and surprise an invading party, they're bugs under my feet.

[toader]

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... wtf... but anyways yeah... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... seriously... ... ... ...

right...on...man,...I...couldnt...have...said...it...better...myself!!!

Scorch is so right. Especially the part where he says: '...'



p.s. If you play your warlock anything like you form sentences, paragraphs or grammar in general, then I feel for you man. Oh yea: ...

[Aerath]

I got suspended for 3 days again. I don't know about aerath but thats the only reason i've been posting a lot on forums lately.

Nope. I just really prefer playing with friends over playing solo... seeing how said friends aren't around, I roam the forums instead :howdy:

[Praxis]

I can understand why so many people underestimate the warlock so much, they're probably the hardest class to master pvp wise. But when you come up against a pro (very few and far between sadly) you can kiss your ass goodbye, I don't care who you are or what class you play.

[Bje]

I gotta say, its so ammusing to read posts about overpoweredness and nerfing.. its my favourite subject ! .. Noone seems to understand that its not the pallie/shaman/WL/whatever in the world of Azeroth that kills you, its the player.. ALWAYS..

When you loose to an alliance/horde, it doesnt mean that class should be nerfed.. !! if you loose once, you may just have met a very good player, if you loose all the time, then i have to tell you, you just suck.. pure and simple! .. Nobody seems to be willing to belive that there is better players out there than youself..

The class getting the most bull**** are, no doubt, paladins (my class:))..

In one thread i read pallies suck, alliance members hate pallies and wants them to die, they suck at everything, oh man, they're so lame, shamans was DESIGNED to rule pallies, any class will gank a pala, all they have to do is bla bla bla, bla bla, bla bla

In a different thread i read, paladins are waaay overpowered, OMG, bubble boy, haha lame ass pala, NERF!, OMG a rogue can not beat a pala in less than 30secs, oh no! nerf the bastard so the poor rogue can gank him in 5, bubble-heal, 2 if fighting meele opponent (LoH is never used in 1o1 pvp), NERF NERF

On one side you have someone who deffinately can never kill a particular class, and on the other you've got thoose who have no problem whatsoever ganking that same class (or any class at all, if they're in the bragging mood)..

End of the line is, you are never killed by a class, only by players.. whats that? you NEVER beat anyone of that class? well maybe you just arent as good as you thought you were, ever think of that?

RE-THINK YOUR STRATEGY

[Trooogdooor]

And shamans is not the most difficult class to beat, deffinately not.. i can pretty much rely on SoC to proc at least once every fight, but i still think its a little annoying that its so unreliable..

okay.... I dunno about you but if I saw a shaman who didn't purge a pally as soon as he came across him.... I would make an alliance character to kill him myself constantly so he would quit playing WoW and contributing to the downfall of the horde....for example, I was dueling 3 pallies, 2 were 46, 1 was 45, with my 42 shaman.... I never lost a single fight and I even had one go onto an alt to tell me that I was a pvp god. It was explained to me later that one of them had full potion buffs..... like agil, fortitude, intel, str...every possible buff he could get. and I was still beating him. I even had one pull out a battle chicken....so I killed it while ignoring the pally, an constantly putting out a lvl 1 stoneskin totem for him to kill, which he apparently didn't notice that shaman's have more than 1 level of. I eventually used a healing potion for that fight, but if he was using his engineering to fight, I would use my alchemy...so it was even.

anyways /wtfpwn 4tw

Edit: my pwning is not limited to pallies, though locks with the felhunter can sometimes kill me if I'm ignoring my health

[Bje]

Well.. like i said, ive never found shamans that hard to beat with my pala..

But i do realise, that maybe i havent met the right shaman, cus there obviously has to be something in it when most ppl think shamans are the best pvp class..

On the other hand, 1v1 fight dont happen all that much, its more often xv1 or a group fight, and its in the group fight i really see the limitations of my pala, cus everyone is more than likely to attack a more squishy target in my group, and so my x number of lives doesnt help all that much :S ..

Btw.. on my server, EU-Ravencrest, horde outnumber alliance by 60-40 :) ..

[dehakker]

I gank alot of players with my pally in WsG, only Shamans are a bit hard to get.

[Sonic]

I'd Say

Tier 1
Priest
Shaman

Tier 2
Rogue
Mage

Tier 3
Warlock
Paladin

Tier 4
Warrior
Druid
Hunter

Tier 3 is somewhat interesting. I (as a Shaman) fear well played Warlocks with wtfpwning Shadow Bolt Crits and Paladins who know how to time Rank 1 SoC right before they hit so I can't purge, and those who don't go full Retribution, but Protection for those Reckoning bombs.
Those are quite rare anyhow, that's why I ranked them so low, most Paladins just auto-attack while they spam their highest rank SoC and then Shield / Hearth out of the way.

[hiroki]

in my opinion this a bit of a my child is the best child. Ask a warrior and they will tell you they rule. I find hunters to be divine when played the propper way. But there are some mages that never seem to run out of mana and do massive damage too and with ice barrier. REmember that undead have an advantage over those warlocks and shadowpriests too, so it depends a bit on our faction. but there is one thing i do agree on and that is that a shaman is too strong. They earthshock everything you throw at them and can jump around you like crazy combine that with mail and healing and they cant be casterkilled in my opinion. All i do when these guys pop up is poly(hope it doesnt get shocked) fireball-instant pyroblast fireblast blast wave coc and restart that or finish off with iae. But most of the time all they have to do is jump out heal and get me when my mana is down.

[Elentor]

Well I'm a hunter and I'm not saying that we rule.
Actually, as far as my experience is going, I think that Warlocks and Rogues are bizarre when well played.
I have already killed dozens and dozens of Druids, Warriors, Shamans etc, but *no* single Warlock yet :(
Mages sometimes give me trouble on WSG but the only one I have dueled "clean" (not on battlegrounds) I won.

Druids and Shamans can be a pain the ass, but I always end up winning.. somehow. But really, overall I think it's well balanced.

Haven't dueled a single hunter yet from my faction, and don't remember any from the battlefield.

[Rodigan]

Being a rogue, I'm able to do very well one-on-one, since I never lose.

I skip the warriors unleass the have less than 50% health, so I never lose there.
Paladins take a long time, and if mind-numbing crits, I only have to beat them twice instead of three times to kill them.
I'm horde, so I don't have to face shamans.
Priests and Warlocks are an easy stunlock, but I might have to use WoF.
Few druids react well to me, but some of them can escape.
Rogues vs rogues, who can control the fight better. Lots of luck involved here.
Mages need to be chased down, but doable.
Hunters can't handle melee.

But in group play, I have several fights between cooldowns, and sometimes minutes pass before I'm out of combat and can restealth. Last time I did WSG, they all remembered what I do to them, and I'm killed very quickly if I show myself.

[hiroki]

now thats crap, "hunters cant handle melee", ive seen hunters dodge and counterstrike for big damage, give em an ice barbed spear or something like that and they will owne a lot of clothusers an leatherusers just by meleeing them. Why do you think they have this talenttree called survival then? And why would they need to be able to melee rogues, flare and they can kite you infinitely, at least good hunters can, but thats the problem, very few gosu hunters out there, but the ones that are, are a though cookie, a nice pet and some of those nice engeneering goodies like that net ( i do believe it comes from engeneering) and melee classes are in a lot of trouble against hunters

[Baboon]

Being a rogue, I'm able to do very well one-on-one, since I never lose.






Most people win 75% here, but you actually never lose :)

I'd love to see the forum where the people that always lose hang out.

[Sonic]

Well, Rogues should be able to choose their fights, so if a Rogue consistently looses in 1v1 without being ganked, he's definitely doing something wrong.

[northernlights]

Being a rogue, I'm able to do very well one-on-one, since I never lose.



Il quote him too, as I only wish he was on my server. I eat rogues for breakfast. I do average against most other classes but rogues, even those that gank me are toast.

I take my share of losses (especially to warlocks, druids, priests) but I'm absoloutly positive I could hand you a nice string of losses.

If its relevant Im a Frost/Arcane Mage.

[hiroki]

same here, druids eat me. i am a Mage too, but i am undead so wotf has an edge over those guys, priests are middle of the road in the hard fights. They odnt go down easy, but neither do I. But druids = stand strong and die noble

[Rodigan]

Il quote him too, as I only wish he was on my server. I eat rogues for breakfast. I do average against most other classes but rogues, even those that gank me are toast.

I take my share of losses (especially to warlocks, druids, priests) but I'm absoloutly positive I could hand you a nice string of losses.

If its relevant Im a Frost/Arcane Mage.

I subtlely mentioned that I pick my fights carefully, i.e. avoiding warriors. I also avoid mages in open fields. I'll follow a mage for minutes, waiting for him to face an impassable object. Cheapshot, SS, (blink, but goes nowhere), gouge, CB Eviscerate, sprint after them to finish them off.

As for hunter's survivability in melee? One on one, never happened. Only chances for them are a hole in stunlock for that dizzying shot of theirs and get away for some kiting.

If it's relevant, I'm a stunlock rogue. Slight deviation from Osirus's PvP build.

[Rodigan]

I stand corrected. I ran into a frost mage that really gave me some trouble yesterday. I tried three times, each time using more of my cooldowns. While one of those times would have been a win without low level rogue interfering, the other two clearly showed that I can have my losing moments.

[Talos]

Seduce-->Curse of Shadow-->ShadowBolt (my 58 'lock has critted for ~1800 a dozen times, usually hits for between 800 and 1400)-->Seduce--->Shadowbolt-->Soulburn (instant 700ish damage, crits for 1200+). If that don't take em down, I got plenty of other fun tricks up my sleeve, but those are a good start.
There is no Soulburn. The only "SoulAnything" which is a nuke is Soul Fire, which has a very long cast time. Shadowburn is instant. Casting a Soul Fire right after a shadowbolt is generally suicide with your tactic. You do not want to stand there for six seconds while your opponent runs up to you and interrupts the hell out of that cast.

[BenDover]

There is no Soulburn. The only "SoulAnything" which is a nuke is Soul Fire, which has a very long cast time. Shadowburn is instant. Casting a Soul Fire right after a shadowbolt is generally suicide with your tactic. You do not want to stand there for six seconds while your opponent runs up to you and interrupts the hell out of that cast.

I'm pretty sure DC mean Shadowburn. Soul Fire wouldn't make any sense except as an opener versus an enemy that hasn't spotted you.

[Talos]

I'm pretty sure DC mean Shadowburn. Soul Fire wouldn't make any sense except as an opener versus an enemy that hasn't spotted you.
Soul Fire is very popular right after the first seduce, in place of a shadowbolt. It does far more damage, but has a 60 second cooldown so it generally can only be safely used once per duel. The tactic which works very well for me is:

Seduce>CoS>Soul Fire>Shadow Bolt>Shadow Burn>Seduce>Shadow Bolt>Shadow Bolt>Shadow Burn. Most players are dead by this time.

A very different but moderately useful strategy against mages and shadow priests is to Fear>Drain Mana. Drain Mana doesn't seem to break fear, and when coupled with their mana intensive spells, it works wonderfully. I generally use seduce to interrupt their longer casts. A mana less mage/priest is a dead mage/priest. A warlocks extremely high hp (+healthstone) coupled with the fact that we can tap or pact our way into more mana makes is very difficult to kill. You should also worry after you've killed us, as we could easily pop up with enouugh mana and hp to finish the job via a soulstone.

[Paperman]

in 1v1 PvP, Hunters have nothing on warriors, sorry to say. If a warrior starts the battle with a charge-> hamstring, hunter has lost. If they switch to intercept-> hamstring, hunter has lost. If you dodge a single attack, and overpower becomes availible, odds are, hunter lost. I am not trying to suggest that hunters are bad, I am just saying that a well played warrior shouldnt have trouble against a well played hunter.

phil

if a warrior start the battle with a charge -> harmstring?? they always do, and are always being ripped by well played hunters. The hunter has a lot of good survivability skills which allows them to get into distance again and rip the warrior before he even comes into range. and what about getting chain freezing trap'ed? good hunters owns the most characters if its played well.

[Falcostorm]

Well I'd rank the classes as follows in pvp - I play as a lvl 60 pally and also have a little exp with a lvl 29 rogue at the lower end (based on WSG exp as AV isnt ever used).

1. Shaman
2. Mage
3. Priest
4. Rogue
5. Hunter
6. Rogue
7. Paladin/Warlock

I havent ranked druids for the fact that I've hardly seen them in BG to able to decide how good they are in PvP.

[Talos]

Well I'd rank the classes as follows in pvp - I play as a lvl 60 pally and also have a little exp with a lvl 29 rogue at the lower end (based on WSG exp as AV isnt ever used).

1. Shaman
2. Mage
3. Priest
4. Rogue
5. Hunter
6. Rogue
7. Paladin/Warlock

I havent ranked druids for the fact that I've hardly seen them in BG to able to decide how good they are in PvP.
You've got Rogue as #4 and #6. Looks like you're also missing Warrior.

[Falcostorm]

yeah should be 6. warrior (dont ask how I confused the typing up :chinny: )

Couldnt see an edit button to edit the post?