News from Blizzard ?

[CreslinHellscream]

Check this out O_o

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6154421.html

[tagkc]

Alas, WebSense strikes again. Can't see it from work. Care to give a brief overview on the article?

[CreslinHellscream]

It says... Horde will get Paladins in the Expansion, as Blood Elves, and Alliance will get Shaman's as Drenai (or whatever its spelt) :(

Apparently now backed up by a blue post on the forums (It just gets worse)

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=9154678&s=blizzard&tmp=1#blizzard

[silkfire]

WHAT?? No way!!! damn u retcon^^

[Cerberus]

Still kinda undecided towards this, but both classes will need a lot of rework to get this to work.
The feeling of this being a cheap fix to the faction imbalance issue doesn't quite escape me either..

[CreslinHellscream]

Same.. Unless they do something cool for shamans I can't really see anyone taking more than 2-3 max on raids, if it stays 40man max anyway.

[Xaero]

I guess they solved the "Horde is better at PvP, Alliance is better at PvE" "problem".

I feel like they are taking away one of the few differences between Alliance/Horde. Just a bit more numbing down the game and catering to the forum trolls, methinks.

[degnar]

More info from Blizzard:
http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-general/9154970.htm
http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-general/9154678.htm

I think this is a good thing overall. Sure, it stinks for the Horde that Alliance gets our best class... but yay, we get paladins! lol /rolleyes

Seriously though, this will allow a lot more customization of situations so that shamen or paladins are actually required for a raid, not just along for their buffs. Balancing required that the two classes be pretty similar, which greatly reduced their potential. That barrier has been removed.

[Thricton]

There's a thing about it on the main page now.

What Horde would make a pally? :P

[Cerberus]

More info from Blizzard:
http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-general/9154970.htm
http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-general/9154678.htm

I think this is a good thing overall. Sure, it stinks for the Horde that Alliance gets our best class... but yay, we get paladins! lol /rolleyes

Seriously though, this will allow a lot more customization of situations so that shamen or paladins are actually required for a raid, not just along for their buffs. Balancing required that the two classes be pretty similar, which greatly reduced their potential. That barrier has been removed.

It will require a lot from new instances, how the next 10 lvls affect raiding and will also affect current raidinstances severely if they don't make some fixes for shamans or nerf palas pretty hard ;)

Still can't see why you would want to fit more than 2 shammys in a raid if they don't do something drastic..

[Suave]

Better link.

http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/burningcrusade/townhall/classcombo.html

*checks date* Wait, it isn't 1st of April...

[Astayanax]

umm a Blood elf paladin? Makes no sense... although it makes a TON more sense than a Dranei Shaman. Seriously, what is Blizzard smoking?

I do understand the need to truly balance out the 2 factions; but it should be done in a more realistic way. Forsaken paladins (since afterall the forsaken undeads in WoW are human) and night elf shamans (I know night elfs are popular enough already bit it is the best class that fits with the lore of having shamans... look at Taurens) make the most sense.

[Naolin]

hmm after the first initial OMG, it makes kinda sense really. And if the classes change a bit upto lvl 70 this might just work fine.

[Sacroth]

I'm gonna cry now.

Even more than when I found out, that they removed the "2 dwarves" /silly.

Undercity flooded with bold blonde bubbleboys. . . heck, that thought alone is so disturbing, one might as well go alliance. :shocked:

[Cerberus]

umm a Blood elf paladin? Makes no sense... although it makes a TON more sense than a Dranei Shaman. Seriously, what is Blizzard smoking?

I do understand the need to truly balance out the 2 factions; but it should be done in a more realistic way. Forsaken paladins (since afterall the forsaken undeads in WoW are human) and night elf shamans (I know night elfs are popular enough already bit it is the best class that fits with the lore of having shamans... look at Taurens) make the most sense.

Judging from the BA faq it seems anything goes these days.. (The part with bloodelves messing up the Draenei intergalactic cruiser).

[Volja]

This is the biggest load of bull**** ever.

Way to kill lore and common sense.

I've already seen an official blizz pic with Dranei as Paladins though? Oh well.. when those ****tard blood elf people come along im going alliance to kill them all.

[silkfire]

Well...at least it ain't Tauren Rogues, that would have been a fatal overkill...

[goat song]

There's a thing about it on the main page now.

What Horde would make a pally? :P

I hope that :P means you're joking...

[Valas Azuviir]

Hmmm..

a) Well, this does resolve the whole, why do the Broken wield shamanistic magic, whereas their more pristine Draenei cousins do not.

b) The BE paladin Lore addition, is a whole lot more iffy, imnsho. I mean, they state that the BE believe that the Light failed them in their hour of greatest need. If, a tool fails to accomplish the task for which it was designed, then you do not keep using it, irrespective if it's poetic justice. If, it doesn't work, then it doesn't work. Heck, this very line of theirs can be used to argue that BE should have neither paladins or priests (shadow way noth withstanding).

c) Thrall and Cairne are willing to put up with the BE paladins for strategic purposes? Sorry, but this just sounds weird. By the very lore provided by Blizzard, both those chaps have a moral fiber, which would make this type of stuff unacceptable.

Thrall has made decisions, which can be considered understandable from a moral pov, whereas from a strategic and tactical pov it was close to madness. I point to the Cycle of Hatred novel (which was released fairly recently, I might add.). Rather than take over Northwatch Keep at the end of the novel, he let the Theramoorians keep it. True, that skirmish was instigated at the behest of the Burning Legion by way of the Burning Blade, but it changed little of the tactical and strategic aspects of the case at hands. Northwatch is a security risk to the Horde.

Then there were some of the choices made by Thrall in the Lord of the Clans novel (the storyline of which, was taken from a Blizzard game, I might add). With Thrall showing mercy to those humans he captured. Whereas, from both a strategic and tactical pov, sowing fear would've been far more useful. Make the enemy think you're a bloodthirsty animal. Bloodthirsty animals do not make use of battle tactics or strategies. Meaning, he will underestimate you, and that can be key to winning the battles and the war.

As for Cairne. Considering how he was represented in WC3, TFT and the Orc mini-campaign and even WoW itself, and the very fact that the Grimtotems still live. Afterall, if he can rationalize "vampiric" paladins, for lack of a better term, than it's even easier to rationalize an accident befalling the Grimtotems and their leader. I mean, those Quill Boars sure make a mess of things, and Magatha is getting on in age, and one's balance isn't quite what it used to be as one grows older. And balance is oh so important on a city connected by way of ropeladders.

The Grimtotems are a threat to his rule and they have not exactly embraced the Tauren nation. Such individuality can be quite dangerous to the group, better to deal with it before it becomes a problem.

d) On the other hand, this ought to help resolve an item problem, which does exist. Plate with Int is mostly useless to the Horde, good for DE mainly. Whereas for the Alliance, chain with int is not so in demand, considering Hunters tend to prefer agi. And of course Dragonscale Leathermaking wasn't that useful to the Alliance either.

e) As for the comments made by Eyonix in this thread (http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-general/9154678.htm). Respectfully, this is a load of Kodo poodoo. Blizzard was quite adamant, that each faction would have their own unique class and that this would not be changed. Course, statements to that nature are no longer available on the Blizzard sites, due to their inefficient board software. It can however, probably still be found in the forum shredders. Still, its search capabilities are not exactly up to that task. We're talking, if I had to hazard a guess, some three months before Open Beta.

If, they indeed did feel strongly that there is much more to gain by this route than there is from the flavor generated by keeping a class unique to a faction, then why create it thusly in the first place. That is highly inefficient.

A change in design vision is one thing, but trying to disguise it as something we had planned all along, but couldn't quite do due to circumstances as seems to be suggested here (http://blue.cardplace.com/cache/wow-general/9154970.htm), but that's my reading of what he says, is a load of malarky.

In addition, the example he uses there to defend their newly chosen path is a poor one. If, a Shaman has an ability to make a foe weaker to say melee attacks, which is needed to defeat a foe, whereas the paladin can make it weaker to magic attacks. In what way are they then homogenized and cut and paste answers? I mean, the guillotine is one way to execute someone, so is the electric chair. But, you cannot say that they're the one and the same, even though they serve a similar purpose and are both devices used for that purpose.

f) Blood Knights huh.. :grin: That was just one of the names suggested by other posters, when I presented my Chaos Lords class idea, during the what is missing from the current game and what do you wish to see added in the expansion discussions we held prior to Closed Beta even. Course, that would've been the faction unique class for Illidan's Outsiders.

All in all, not quite sure what to make of this. There are arguments against and pro this course.

[Dutchgrass]

Screw lore tbh. Horde got the short end of the raiding stick and even though a lame fix, it's a much needed fix.

[snowieken]

Well...at least it ain't Tauren Rogues, that would have been a fatal overkill...I am still waiting for the day I can roll my longly anticipated Forsaken Druid.

[degnar]

Gameplay-wise I think this will be helpful. It just gives Bliz so much more freedom to develop the classes, items, encounters, etc.

@Valus -- you're spot on. I'm not much of a lore junkie myself (more interested in the game mechanics), but their explanations are pretty bogus. They basically decided to make this change, come up with some background for the lore, and did a lousy job at it.

[Shellar]

This is the best thing that Blizzard has ever done for us.

[Volja]

I think they just killed themselves.

I bet they retract it at some point.

[Bigairbrucey]

Sounds good to me ...Horde Warriors now have to share their plate ...'snicker'

[snowieken]

It's still outrageous that I can't make my Gnome Shaman, another character I was dying to try.

[Shellar]

Blood for Blood Knights! Skulls for the throne of Illidan!

[shadowrender]

i am very angry at blizzard for doing this :(
they broke my heart, im going to take those flowers back now blizzard

a very sad shadowrender

[Merging soul]

It's a positive hange and done for the better of the game users. Trust me when they come around you'll love Grace of air totem mixed with pallidan buff. Pwnage

[amgyn]

bad move for blizzard... very bad move.


(to the people that say you only need 3 shamans in a raid, obviously never played horde... shaman buffs are GROUP specific, unlike pally buffs which are class specific)

[Loriel]

I'll agree that the lore side of this is a bit iffy, and it feels somewhat like a cheap fix to the problem of class (or, indeed, faction) balancing. Still, it allows for some interesting raid compositions - especially if buffs like Tranquil Air Totem stack with BOS etc. Ofc you will need to rotate some classes out of your raid to make room for the new palas/shammies, which adds to the variety of it all.

TBH, I think WoW's immediate future will bring more variety to how people can compose their groups/raids, and introducing paladins/shamans to the opposite faction is just one part of this. BC will introduce new skills and abilities (starting at level 40), and then there's the 60-70 abilities and talents - allowing for the fact that raid strategies need to be revised. More is more in this case, I think - it never hurts to have more options and variety.

Personally I have only raided as Alliance, and I certainly wouldn't mind having a Shaman in my group - or indeed rolling one myself.