What owns Shamans in pvp?

[semisonic9]

Just curious. I know some shammy friends of mine who rock. We're mid-level, so I'm curious about end-game...thinking of rolling a Shammy once my Priest is done.

[Aerath]

Dunno... never had too much trouble fighting shammies so far. Not on my Druid and not on my Rogue.

Priests can mana burn them after which they're essentially dead.
Rogues can stunlock them/kick their healing. Suffer the same problem as always though - if they get kited they lose.
Warriors... probably have a hard time.
Mages - whoever bursts more or gets the jump wins I suppose.
Hunters - no clue on this match up. Can see it go either way.

I'd expect paladins to outlast Shammies, so that's not a problem either.

I honestly don't see why alliance keeps crying out over Shammies. They're so incredibly dependent on a few crit strings. If wind fury doesn't proc and/or crit they have a problem. If shocks don't crit they have a problem. Get a triple windfury crit followed by a crit shock and you just 'pwned' someone. If it doesn't happen... you basically don't do all that much.

[semisonic9]

Well, I'm Horde, for one thing, so I'm not sweating what the alliance is worried about.

They seem fine mid-level, I guess they hit some trouble later on though. Mmkay, thanks for the answers.

[Serrat]

personally its warlocks i hate, priests as well depending on myspec.

warriors can be a pain if well geared.

hunters, if they manage to kite then they win, if i get in distance they lose

rogues if the manage to stun lock then im dead.

mages, not really a problem

[brandondash]

Warlocks. =)

[deamian]

I don't have much trouble with Shaman as a Warrior, smack pummel their healing, hamstring/pierce howl them so they can't out run you when they drop that damn slow totem, and intercept if they do get away /shrug

[Stormblack]

Yup, one on one, we either get lucky and kill you in 5 secs or we're in serious trouble. We have no crowd control to give us room to breath, no instant heals, hit us from range or fear/stun us and we're almost immediately on the defensive unless we overgear/outlevel our opponent by a large margin. Over an extended fight our mana deplete's VERY quickly.

Playing my 57 shaman in AV I just wish we were half as invincible as alliance mythology would have people believe. :)

[Steamboat]

As a warlock, it seems like all the Shamans I fight are very, very good at their class.

If I try to fear, a tremor totem is down. If I try to death coil, a grounding totem is down and I just wasted a 2 minute CD. If I just try to dot them, they melee me and I die before my dots can work. If I almost win, they insta-heal back to full. If I try to kite, I get a frostshock. If I try to kill the totems, I may as well stand there and say "melee my cloth a$$ to death."

[xxlebox]

Just outdamage them, their healing wont be able to make up for it, and they die. nothing hard about shamans.

[Sangellas]

Anything dual-wielding a glowing weapon.

[construct]

Priests can mana burn them after which they're essentially dead.

Mana burn has a 3.5 second casting time, and with earthshock spammy shamans, you aren't going to get one off. Want to shield yourself? Purged. Inner Fire, Stamina buff? All purged. Renew? Purged. Try to heal? Earth shocked. Priests don't have a prayer vs a shaman that knows what he's doing.

[Cerberus]

Shamans have a bunch of countercaster tricks and none of them really has any huge cooldown. You have to burst them down pretty much.

No problems with paladins, but might be somewhat related to specc. With mail and decent healing abilities you can outheal the damage and kite them (or so I've been told).

[porps]

i have no trouble with them on my rogue, but they absolutely rape my priest.

[degnar]

Warlock owns shaman (unless they are really bad).

Shaman owns mages and priests.

Everyone else... could go either way.

[Thoragord]

I am a paladin but in BGs I havent had trouble with any shamans yet. I am only lvl 29 though with my first toon. I dont know much about what shamans can do but I just Seal of Command and hit them and when they get low on health I stun then judge seal for about 150 damage. If they slow me I just bless freedom, if i get low I heal. So far I can take most players one on one unless they are a twink or just a lot beter at PvP than me (not hard for them I assure you)

[Gyoza]

shadow priest for one....

[omicronshrike]

Question: What owns a shaman?

Answer: A lot of skill and a friend to help you.

A shaman has tools to deal with any class. However certain spec'd shammies have a beter time vs. certain classes. That is the nature of hybrids. A resto/enhance shaman fares better vs a rogue than other specs. However a elem/resto shaman may do better vs. a warrior. When i repeced to resto on my shaman i would duel a better geared hunter friend of mine and win all the time, he repeced to survival and then there was not a thing i could do to kill him. I respeced to elem/enhance when my guild disbanded and again I would beat him most of the time. A good bet for pvp vs a shaman is a lock. Dots, fear, and high stam, and pet are a tough thing to beat. But a well played sham can deal with that barring the shammy is not considerably out geared. Purge, drop grounding and tremor totem(fast cool down so keep dropping it so you are always in range of its ticks if they run away) earth shock cast attempts (rank 1 will do the trick to conserve mana for the heals you WILL need). Pound away with 2h. If imp out shock or hit it. It will die quickly. If succy tremor tote takes care of that. Felhound doesn't do too much damage and the spell lock doesn't last that long.

[Suicider]

Playing a level 49 elemental shaman (29/11), the only class that there's no way in hell I can win against is shadow priests, especially if they silence me at the right time, IE when I need to heal.
Other than that, warlocks are a pain in the lower back, especially affliction ones.. Fear spam FTW, the slow pulsing on tremor means that you usually get out of range before it pulse, unless you standing atop it.
Classes that should turn and run when they meet a shaman are warriors and rogues, unless in small spaces where you can't kite.. Paladins are quite easy, depending on specc... Retadins with Eye for an Eye are really hard to beat, because my spell crits will basically turn me to ashes as well ^^

[amgyn]

a skilled shaman cant be defeated by any class.. as they have tools to help them against all classes...

casters == grounding totems, tremor totems etc.
melee == earthbind totem, frost shock, shield etc...

eg.. against a mage... earthshock as they cast, followed by a earthbind and a grounding totem, purge, attack at will.. between timing your earthshocks and your your grounding totem properly.. mage will go down fast.

eg vs. warlock... tremor right away, earthshock, grounding totem.. cant fear, cant cast x2... you got the first upperhand..

warrior.. frostshocks and earthbind .. shield +1hander with flame tongue.

rogue .. earthbind, poison cleanse, flameshock so no vanish...

.. skill > class anyday.

[Raistlin Majere]

Warlocks seem to, and Warriors that get lucky crits seem to be able to kill them very fast. Almost all the shaman I've played against blow off their healing until their health bar is red, which is Execute rage on warriors. On my druid it is more if they have enoguh spell damage to put those crits to good use. I perfer to out last them, My druid has a higher mana pool, and my regen rate seems more. Once they are oom, its usually safe to go out in cat form and finish them off or stay in bear form. Shammie melee damage is laughable to bear armor.

[Pongle]

Skill + Gear owns shamans in pvp.

[Diamondlights]

Who said Shammy heals are no good? Lots of rubbish posts here, tbh.

Class Rock, Paper, Scissors > Gear > Spec > Skill

[NocturneNight]

With my 44 MS warrior it can usually go any way when I fight a Shaman. Most of the times I can get a charge in, which doesn't seem to matter much. If I crit alot, I win, if he procs windfury or something my hp is gone so fast I don't know what hit me. The shamans that tried to kite/outlast me have all died though, I always seem to time my intercept and pummel; else the MS debuff is pretty nasty for healers. Funny the hardest shamans for me seems to be the ones who go melee, but I've seen that Shams who go melee with wars at 60 pretty much gets twoshotted, so I guess it's just a phase and my, rather crappy gear. ^^

On my 60, GM Hunter, I have a lot more losses than wins to shamans, since it's so damn easy for them to get close and their frostshocks can crit for 1k+ while their spells hit damned hard (assuming we have equal gear). Many shamans simply pull out their shield and starts blasting at range which wins the fight for them since I can't do anything but fight them at range (Hunter's preference), and they've got way too much armor for my hits to matter.

With my crap geared rogue I win alot more however. Aslong as you get the jump and have poisions on your blades; a shaman needs lucky and big crits to win.

I've always wanted to try a shammy, but I dislike the Horde too much to play one. Funny now in the expansion I will roll a Dranei Shaman and see how that turns out. Will be fun seeing those undead mages fleeing for their (un)lives.

[semisonic9]

Well, a shammy repeatedly owned my SP the other day at lvl 41.

He was geared out for pvp though, while I had only grinding gear.

We chatted for awhile, but with all the interupting totems and without the ability to switch faster between wands to kill the damn totems (why the **** did they make totems immune to instant cast spells? If I want to blow mana, let me!), spell-casting was pretty well neutralized. With no shield to take at least a few shots from the totems, and his good melee weapon for close range, I really had very little chance, much harder than a warlock or mage at this level. The only time I got even close was with lucky blackouts and fears between his trinket cooldown.

How things change in the high game, I don't know, but I'd imagine I'd have to have a ton more HP and quite a bit more damage from the DoTs to get close on a regular basis.

How high does Shammy HP go up to, anyways?

[timebomb]

Any lock level 50 and above and MS warriors are the hardest IMO at level 60.

[Valroshe]

Not to brag or anything just putting my 2 cents...

I am a 60 shammy with decent gear (rank 10 set + ZG stuffs)
I take down tier 2 + 3 mages with ease, normally not even down 25% health at the end. Warriors, only win if they are tier 2+ and have a nasty 2H and even then it is a close fight. Rogues as mentioned, almost always win if they get the jump on me however if they flaw for 1 second on the stun lock i war stomp and own them. Locks are always a close fight, if they win they have less than 10% health. Pallies are annoying as all hell, usually I get bored and stomp and GW away cus I get sick of the bubble heal, stun heal, heal, heal, heal, heal, LoH, heal, heal, etc... The whole time they hardly ever do any damage to me. And Hunters well... all I can say is cake.

This weekend while grinding AB rep, I saw that the LM only had 1 guard visible, a pally, but NOONE would help me go up there so I said screw it and went up. The pally was in full Lawbringer, I think it is called, so fairly well geared. I ran up to him and had him at about 10% in a few secs, interupted his heal with a ES just as a stealthed rogue sapped me, she was pretty well geared too. The pally not able to heal for a WHOLE 2 secs wacked me out of stun hehe so I proceeded to kill him with a fast NS+CL and warstomped to get a bit of space between me and the rogue. After a bit of hassle and being left at 15% health I took her down and capped the flag. :shocked:
Needless to say I was amazed...

What I am getting at is that I too believe in nthe rock paper scissors thing, and have yet to find anything that truly "OWNS" me, yes if certain things happen or certain gear is there I do get owned but for the most part it is about skill and timing.

[brandondash]

I am interested to learning how you can compete against warlocks so well. Fear is death, is it not?

brandon-

[Valroshe]

I don't really seem to have much trouble with them, but I credit that to thier own stupidity most times. The ones that are smart enough to look around for my tremor totem are usually the ones who hurt the most. I find that if you charge right at them and drop your grounding totem once you are about 10 yrds away then be rdy to ES thier next spell then you are on top of them run thru them while you swing your BIG mace at em and drop a tremor totem it usually ends up about 5+ feet behind them so they have to look around for the totem so if they don't bother then you are golden the totem breaks the fear you spin and ES that big BOLT spell they were casting, stomp and proceed to beat them into the ground. Works almost everytime, like i said if they bother to search for the totem then you are gonna be hurting.

[Valroshe]

OH and if you get DCed start spamming your grounding totem cus DC last like 2 secs and usually they go for a 3 sec cast time spell after they DC. So as soon as it breaks you drop a Grounding totem and that spell gets munched.:afro: :thumbsup:

[Jinnix]

On my 60 warlock shaman are easy mode to kill.

[Gyoza]

shammies are not that super special. they are just different than other classes. make the adjustment and its the same difficulty as anything else.

[Shinnokk]

I'm a Warlock i have a hard time, once the new patch comes out Shamans will own me witht here duel-wield crusader windfury XD...Warriors i actualy have no problem i'm not soul link but i never have problems with warriors..maybe because every warrior i go against is a newb? lol

[rmvetski]

ehhh someone knows very little about shamans

im elemental specced with NS

paladins are no problem, I dont care if they have sulfuras or whatever
fire nova, lightning bolt, chain lightning, earth shock, gg

warriors, same as above

mages, the very well geared fire mages can beat me if they time their stuff well and use instants only, I can still cast grounding totem and heal almost to full health without them interrupting 90% of the cases, most mages however are a walkover

priests, contrary to popular belief, the hard ones are discipline not shadow, they have more mana than me and if they are good they will use it sparingly, shadow priests tend to be overconfident and die quick

warlocks, im orc so fear can be a problem, I can purge soul link so you know what happens to those, it's a little like the fire mages, very well geared locks can rock my world, that's that

rogues are the hardest imho, the good ones know how to deal with range and kiting someone who is using sprint is just pointless, if they take my poison cleansing totem it's usually gg, still I beat most handily

enhancement shamans, close 2nd to rogues, very hard to beat, very, they know my tricks and can hit freakishly hard

hunters, well im not trying to get near them so they usually get a little confused, without naxx gear their white dmg is not spectacular with windfall totem down and 5k armor, when they try get funny there's fire nova, frost shocks and lightnign bolts, I outdmg them so no fears, some few have amazing dps so it's a gear fight more than anything

druids are dead meat, no questions asked, no matter the spec, just plain dead, purge, purge, flame shock, grounding totem, searing totem, lb, lb, it's like fighting a mob

I think that covers it, elemental shaman > all except rogues and warlocks and highly skilled and geared discipline/shadow priests(the latter is a rarity)

[Lord_Shinnok]

I'm a Warlock i have a hard time, once the new patch comes out Shamans will own me witht here duel-wield crusader windfury XD...Warriors i actualy have no problem i'm not soul link but i never have problems with warriors..maybe because every warrior i go against is a newb? lol

i dont know who you are and i have nothing to add to the topic at hand but your name is too close to mine and i dont approve.

gorny, take care of business

[Chemm]

my shaman gets torn up... he has TuF, 4/6 Champions set, Teir 1 shoulders/chest... but...

Locks - chin fear me
Mages - Pyro + Fireball + ignite... even if i get s grounding totem down in time mages usually do so much dmg 1 spell doesnt prevent them from blowing me up.
Rogues - Stunlocked, no chance.
priest - Outheal my damage / mana burn me
Warrior- MS warrior? game over if he knows how to play, keeps me MSed/Hamstringed
Hunter- Kite me around, keep viper stinging me, and your pet on me.
Pally- Lately some paladins are basically stun locking me, which is so annoying, Hoj at the start put out as much dmg as possible and if you have Reviction (the other stun cant remember the exact name of it) hold it until im about to heal or at... 35% then stun me and when i hit 20% use your HoW.

Shamans dmg output got nerfed in 2.0 =(

[Chemm]

a skilled shaman cant be defeated by any class.. as they have tools to help them against all classes...

casters == grounding totems, tremor totems etc.
melee == earthbind totem, frost shock, shield etc...

lol, Tremor totem never works, and a simple wand eats the grounding, and unless your a resto shaman, you wont have a shield on.


eg.. against a mage... earthshock as they cast, followed by a earthbind and a grounding totem, purge, attack at will.. between timing your earthshocks and your your grounding totem properly.. mage will go down fast.


besides when i run into a mage it's sheep+ Pyro, followed by a fire blast,blast wave all together is doing 3500 dmg at minimum, then im left with 500 health, i try to heal... Counter spell. gg.


eg vs. warlock... tremor right away, earthshock, grounding totem.. cant fear, cant cast x2... you got the first upperhand..


Ummm they can either do... seduce, sick there pet at me that cleaves me for 500 a shot, Deathcoil, or say they try and fear me and i break it with earth shock, what is preventing them from doing again? it has a 6 sec CD, and once a shaman is feared, game over... Nothing breaks fear for us other then a totem we have to lay prior to the fight and doesnt work against DC.


warrior.. frostshocks and earthbind .. shield +1hander with flame tongue.


A good geared warrior, MS build, or actually fury warrior too, they do too much dmg for me to keep up, if they charge or intercept me i cant switch to a shield, frost shock and earthbind dont work if he has already charged in and hamstringed me and keeps it on me...


rogue .. earthbind, poison cleanse, flameshock so no vanish...

Open up with Cheap shot, back stab me for 700-900, do some white dmg, kidney shot me throw another backstab in, gouge me as the stun is going to break, if I have any life left now im surprised, they could Evis me or wait til i try and heal and kick me, locking out all of my spells but Frost/Flame shock.


.. skill > class anyday.

After the 2.0 patch not imo, there is way too much damage compared to stamina, too many fights are 2-4 seconds long, Shaman v Pallys used to go forever for me and it was fun now, one of us will win in 30-45 seconds...

[brandondash]

I loooove the doom-and-gloom posts. OMG SHAMANS ARE TEH BROKEZ0RS

and unless your a resto shaman, you wont have a shield on.
Then you are a bad player. Always always always switch to shield in midfight for rogues and warriors. Hell even Laintime switches to a shield when he is facing rogues, and he has plate!

besides when i run into a mage it's sheep+ Pyro, followed by a fire blast,blast wave all together is doing 3500 dmg at minimum, then im left with 500 health, i try to heal... Counter spell. gg.
So many things wrong with this. Ok first of all you earthshock or ground their polymorph. See you have your grounding totem because you didn't drop it until midcast so they wouldn't have a chance to wand it. Even if they did you still have your shock.

They also won't wand that grounding totem you drop if they are busy trying to frontload nuke you should they get off that sheep. You ground their fireblast, then you fire resist totem their blastwave. Suddenly that 500 health is closer to 2000 health.

They also aren't going to counterspell your heal because you dupe it and so they counterspell nothing at all. Alternately if you don't trust lag you could have them counterspell your hearthstone.

That is of course unless they went arcane and have improved counterspell! At which point you drink the combat healing potion that you have (which only cost 9s btw) and suddenly you have 2800 health and all they have left is cone of cold and arcane explosion, neither of which are going to kill you in 4 seconds.

Now... if they went DEEP arcane then once every 3 minutes they can zhc+ap+pom+pyro 1shot you for over 5k. Shrug, that's life. The other 2 minutes 45 seconds you can beat them. PLUS they just blew every cooldown they had on you, so it stands to reason you should blow your reincarnate and smash their face =)

<stuff about warlocks>
Yup, warlocks are a pain in the neck. Imo our hardest matchup.

A good geared warrior, MS build, or actually fury warrior too, they do too much dmg for me to keep up, if they charge or intercept me i cant switch to a shield, frost shock and earthbind dont work if he has already charged in and hamstringed me and keeps it on me...
Insignia or the Horde and Free Action Potion? Believe it or not neither of these are considered cheating. Also, why do you say you can't switch to shield? Of course you can.

Open up with Cheap shot, back stab me for 700-900, do some white dmg, kidney shot me throw another backstab in, gouge me as the stun is going to break, if I have any life left now im surprised, they could Evis me or wait til i try and heal and kick me, locking out all of my spells but Frost/Flame shock.
Does the rogue you are fighting have 200 energy? What you just said is impossible unless they thistle tea or adrenaline rush. For the former, you should feel happy that they felt so threatened that they had to waste a 5 minute cooldown on you. For the later, the only dagger build with AR is pure pve. First you aren't going to find many rogues out in the world jumping people with 15/31/5. Secondly, if they do you only have to survive that first flurry of activity and they will be completely out of tricks.

Having said that, Rogues are pretty tough, but then they are tough for everybody else too. Insignia of the Horde gets you out of the stunlock, NS+heal keeps you around long enough to drop your poison totem. Suddenly they can't slow you down and you kite them to death. It's a crapshoot whether you can pull it off, but then if everything was a guaranteed win the class would be pretty boring wouldn't you say?

After the 2.0 patch not imo, there is way too much damage compared to stamina, too many fights are 2-4 seconds long, Shaman v Pallys used to go forever for me and it was fun now, one of us will win in 30-45 seconds...
That will change in a month, but everybody knows that. Love it or hate it at least we don't have to deal with it for very long.

brandon-

[Raistlin Majere]

druids are dead meat, no questions asked, no matter the spec, just plain dead, purge, purge, flame shock, grounding totem, searing totem, lb, lb, it's like fighting a mob

Get back at me when you play against a real druid. If its like fighting a mob he's AFK.

[brandondash]

Druids are an insanely hard matchup.

[Xaero]

My hunter has very little problem with Shammys. Stay at a distance, use pet. Viper Sting and Silencing shot. Wing Clip if they try to get in close to melee and kite them around.