AV Strategy

[Denniskly]

Hi, i'm new playing on AV, but before i started it i read about it on the internet (Yes, i'm often bored). Then when i started it i thought about this cool strategy. Maybe a lot of you guys won't do it, it's just, when i read about the Underground Assault, Cavalry, Aeiral Attack and Ultimate Monster, i thought it would be pretty cool. But when i started it, most people (to my dissapoitment) rather wanted to finish it quick instead of using stuff like Ultimate monsters etc.

So, maybe my strategy isn't the quickest or most secure in winning. But i think it's pretty funny and rewarding. If just ONE group of 40 could all use this strategy, it would be nice :D If anyone sees a weakness or something plz report on this thred.

Strategy will be shown in next post, since it's too big.

[Denniskly]

Picture of Alterac Valley can be found here: http://wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/battlegrounds/map-alterac.html

Okay, first of all this is a raid of 40 players, we divide into 8 groups of 5. (Experienced players may scroll down to Mission 1)

Winning Objective!: To win we need to kill the enemys General. The Hordes General is lying deep with the Frostwolf Keep, while the Alliance General is bored in Dun Baldar. But to get the funniest (and most rewarding) out of it, we need to, on the same time, need a Cavalry, a Underground Assault, an Aeiral Attack, and at last our Ultimate Monster. With all this on the same time we will thrash all of their towers, bunkers and Captains!!

Things you should know: When you are going to return Storm Crystals, the alliance druid who wants it is hiding behind one of your northern bunker, while the horde druid is in the cave under Frostwolf Keep.
Here is a little list over stuff you shouldn't sell or drop unless your enemys General got under 10% life:
Armor Scraps, Storm Crystals / Stormpike Soldier's Blood, Coldtooth- Irondeep Supplies, Forstwolf Hide / Alterac Ram Hide, Frostwolve Soldier- -Lieutnant- and -Commanders Medal, Stormpike Soldier -Lieutnant- and -Commanders Flesh.
Always remember to return your Armor Scraps, when you gathered a large amount. Oh, and also keep looting stuff from the enemy.
If the battle is getting on to your side of the field, call for help at the other groups.

List of Quests (not real quest name):
Group 1 Group 2-7 Group 8

Collect Supplies Rescue Wing Commanders Gather Skins (ram / wolf)
Tame Mounts Gather Loot Rescue Wing Commanders
Rescue Wing Commanders Gather Loot
Gather Loot

Mission 1 "Ground Assault": To launch an attack from the ground, we need supplies from the 2 mines on the battleground. When the game begins we need EVERYONE to go the "base" and get their respective quests (as mentioned above). Afterwards EVERYONE go and take over the mine closest to your position. Then everyone except group 1 starts charging towards the enemys "base"(the battle should be right now at the towers). Meanwhile, group 1 takes care of there mission: to gather alot of supplies for the Ground Assault. The other mine isn't needed, and since it's on the enemys side it's also too dangerous.

Mission 2 "Cavalry": When enough supplies are gathered for a Ground Assault, we need to think of the Cavalry. It need mounts, lots of mounts. So group 1 start taming Rams/Wolves for the base. Meanwhile group 8 sneaks out of the big battle and starts slaying Rams/Wolves on the enemys side of the field so they can get the skin for the warriors on the cavalry. After group 1 or 8 done with their part of the mission they go the battle.

Mission 3 "Aerial Attack": While mission 2 is developing and the battle (should) is moving towards the enemys base, all groups in the attack should search for Wing Commanders in the enemys base. When all are rescued and the cavalry also are ready, it's time for our final strike.

Mission 4 "All Gather Up!": Now everyone returns to the base with all of their loots (Armor Scraps, Storm Crystals / Stormpike Soldier's Blood etc.). Armor Scraps are returned so our NPC's should upgrade to the last level (hopefully, they already are :D). Storm Crystals / Stormpike Soldier's Blood so we can summon our Ultimate Monster. And Frostwolve Medals / Stormpike Flesh, so our Wing Commanders get ready for launch. Now we need 4 high-reputated players. One for ultimate, one for Cavalry, one for Aeiral Attack, and one for Ground Assault. Each of these players should be accompanied with 9 other players (so there are 2 groups at each attack wave), so our attacking NPC's are getting healed and buffed. Now we start summoning our Ultimate Monster, here we might need all 40 players to defend the summoning. When the summoning is complete the Monster will charge against the enemys base, meanwhile the groups go to their respective wave and start their wave as fast as possible, but for best results they should be started at same time as the summoning is completed. Now it's time!! The Cavalry, the Ground Assault and the Aerial Attack is charging toward the enemys base and should catch up with our Ultimate Monster, with it combined we should easily destroy every tower, bunker, Lieutnant's, Commanders and Captains!! At last, we should use all of our slay to destroy the general! If you succeed in this you are victorious! Congratz!!

[GamerX]

Whatever your strategy may be, if it involves more than "all turtle" or "all offense", you will need a premade raid and you need to get them all in the same AV. This is the most difficult part, but possible.

If you did manage it, I have almost no doubt you will win in less than 10 minutes, since at least the half of the opposite faction is aware your steamrolling premade and will not even leave their starting cave. The other half is too busy to dispute how to defend or if at all and getting at least some objectives. So there is no need for a "special" strategy after you got your raid in AV.

And it is illusory to manage a random group of 40 people to do anything complicated, and every order involving "all" will result in just a "few".

[timebomb]

Stratigy is all fun fine and good. but in my battle group horde has all but given up any chance to win AV. it's makes me so mad that you see 10 guys standing in the cave leaching honor. you ask them what they are doing and they say we cant win anyways. i hate this additude. personaly win or lose AV is the fastest way to honor solo. sure it would be nice to win once in a while but its hard when the players hearts are not into it.

i found specing for AV and living in there is some dam fast honor. i think out of 45 honor tolkens i have won 2x. horde needs a pep talk. all i read in BG/ chat is bunch of name calling and pissed off people.

what do you think i can say in AV to change things?

[GamerX]

You can "say" nothing in AV to change things, but you can do. If you have fun fighting others, just go with your offense to do the objectives. There will be always some of the opposite faction you can fight. If you like more defending, go defend. It is really that easy, just do what gives you the most fun. And please let the other do, what they think it is fun for them.

Please do not think, there is something EVERYONE should feel funny (like winning), because it is not.

I for example like the numbers of my Addon "Titan Yhonor" honor per hour the most. And this means, since I'm Ally, I am captured in AV because there I get the most honor per hour, BUT ONLY if the game ends in less than 30 minutes. I don't care if we win or lose (in my BG we win about 60%), but I care of the objectives and that they will be guarded, so every tick of +14 honor I'm more happy. I could't care less if there is a premade Horde against us and single-pull Vanndar in less than 10 minutes, as long as we get our 211 bonus honor from our objectives.

But your prayers are heard ;-) soon the Horde will be so well geared, that even 20 offense will easily beat 40 Ally defenders and the Elites, so there will be just the HK honor from killing some of the 20 attacker for us Allys. Yesterday I saw the first "Grunt Warlock" with full HWL equip, he alone steamrolled 5 of us, because we just have 1 or 2 parts of the FM armor and no GM weapon. (And of course we were lousy PvPers ;-) )

[timebomb]

I'm glad that when the NPC's where a part of AV i was able to get Exulted with them then. this is my plan now in AV. i go on offence and fight over SH and the flag on our side of bridge SP i think (that may be the other 1) untell i have 100+ kills then i go on Defence to finish the match defending our last 2 flags. i normaly end up geting 300 or more kills and around 150-200 bonus honor.

I know that you can only kill a guy 5x for honor so 5x40=200 kills and by rights your maxed. but what can i do while i wait for the game to end.

some times i go to IB and defend there 1st then head up to offence but by the time i get back to defending FW its over run with alli. well thats my time in AV.

[Steamboat]

To the Op: Your strategy sounds fun, but no one wants to have fun in AV. They want to get their honor and their mark, and then get out of there.

Also, afaik you can't join AV as a group or even as a raid.

[Grendo]

Denn, why I applaud your enthusiasm the above simply isnt possible.

Aside from needing an opposing team who actually doesnt win during all your gathering and focusing elsewhere, and needing 39 other people who actually want to see this happen, timing it so it all happens at once would be nill impossible.

1. Wing commanders have to run back from the other side of the map, survive, and then accept turnins before being allowed to fly off to a particular position.

2. The 'ultimate' mob you summon has a few problems. First, he doesnt move for 5min after hes summoned successfully. This only can happen when your druids/shamans are at the spawn location, safely, and not being attacked/kited etc. Not as easy as you may think, 40 guarding or not. He can then be kited decently easily away from anywhere you can protect him.

3. Wolf/Ram riders - other than a post/check at a middle graveyard they have a set path that they wont stop for, except to kill. Controlling the timing would be difficult to say the least.

4. Towers/Gy caps. All these things wont wait for you to cap gys and towers. Graveyards take 2min or so to 'cap', towers take 5min. No NPC will help do this other than clearing npcs/players nearby on their way to their main target.

So even if you were to, theoretically, time turnins with delays/timers, none would stay coordinated for very long. You simply dont have that kind of control.

[GamerX]

To the Op: Your strategy sounds fun, but no one wants to have fun in AV. They want to get their honor and their mark, and then get out of there.

Also, afaik you can't join AV as a group or even as a raid.

There is an Addon that may help you:

http://wow.curse-gaming.com/en/files/details/4563/stinkyqueue/

[Ryste]

To the Op: Your strategy sounds fun, but no one wants to have fun in AV. They want to get their honor and their mark, and then get out of there.

Also, afaik you can't join AV as a group or even as a raid.

Getting as much honor as fast as possible and then go get my hwl gear is fun :).

[JFoobar]

And it is illusory to manage a random group of 40 people to do anything complicated, and every order involving "all" will result in just a "few".

I am horde and generally win about 1 in 15 or so AVs.

Up until a few days ago I had a /bg chat macro that I would use if no one else seemed to be trying to take charge of the group. The macro basically says:

"Groups 1/2/3 on D at Galv, everyone else on O, kill all LTs."

The object here is to get 10 ppl to actually show up and play delay D at Galv and it only works one game in five.

Two days ago I ran that macro with about 45 seconds to game start some tool started arguing with me saying only groups 1/2 should go since we only need 10 there. I responded that the object is to get 10 to show up since, statistically speaking, at least 1/3 of these 3 groups will ignore the post. I made no dent in this guy's flawed logic at all. The ultimate result was that six of us showed up (I went on D also even though I was in group 5) and we got steamrolled by 25 alliance repeatedly.

After that game I have given up for good even trying to lead AV groups into some semblance of a sound strategy. I just play the same way now that I played when I was first learning AV. I follow the O to SH and hope that some stop to help me cap LTs and Balinda (usually they do). We almost always lose in < 30 minutes and only take SP GY about 75% of the time and their aid station about 20% of the time. Most games end with us still fighting in front of the AS with Van sitting cozy and untouched in his bunker. I get my 155-200 honor + HKs and requeue.

The thing is, the people that go O no matter what are probably playing the most efficient way they can are probably right for ignoring me or anyone else that tries to get the group to employ a strategy that at least gives us more than a tiny shred of a chance to actually win the game. Getting your average AV PuG to follow directions is futile so I have stopped bothering and just farm honor like everyone else.

[THOTHdha]

OP: Your ideas do sound nice, and probably would have gone far back in the days of 5 hour AV. However, with the current state of things it's just not worth it. Of course it is always better to win than lose, but when the other team is putting up a fight you have to weigh your time vs rewards. Allowing the Alliance to ride right on past is the way to go.

169 honor for taking all of the honor targets around SH GY and killing Commander Duffy and losing in 15-20 minutes or 253 honor for holding the Alliance back, summoning your NPCs, and killing Vanndar in 60 minutes. Seeing as honor kills in AV are just barely above worthless under the new system it's pretty clear what option gives the most honor.

Without the instant queues that the Horde have it is slightly different for the Alliance. Thier best bet, however, is still to put up a small Defence at SP GY and push hard into FW Villiage. It actually comes out to very similar Honor Per Hour for both sides, actually. Assuming the above scenero where SP GY defence holds it's 169 honor for instant queue +15 minute loss for the Horde, 283 honor for 20ish minute queue + 15 minute win for Alliance. 253 honor for the victor and 225 honor for the loser if each side manages to take all of the honor targets.

[Eonblue]

Yes and just so i can say it once and for all...the best chance to win Alliance AV pug is to Zerg...get galv if you can but if you meet strong resistance skip him and go to FW and RH. The key to this is to win quickly.
I have had many recent encounters where some idiot calls out to 'capture everything' and tries to convince everyone to stay midfield if TP or something is in dispute before moving on.
So if you are relativly new to av..the key to win is zerg, and you get more honor by winning :)
If horde is going to win, thats when you complete quest and turlte for honor kills. :)