Real life WoW troubles *Need your advice*

[Martineau]

I’ve been playing WoW now for about two and a half years, and my buddy has been playing for about a year now. We recently rolled some Horde characters on The Underbog and have been leveling then through quests up until last night. Last night we ran our first instance together with these characters, Wailing Caverns, and things didn’t go so good. We were running the instance with a 23 feral druid (me), a 22 priest (my buddy), and a 22 rogue; I thought this would be enough to run WC considering I’ve ran the instance with just a druid and a rogue. Well, while fighting my buddy would gain aggro on a patrol and rather then sit still and let me gain it from him he proceeded to run around and fear the mobs which made it almost impossible to gain aggro from him. I let him know to sit still and let me gain aggro from him rather then running around, and we continued. Later we’re fighting a group of three, and my buddy is off at almost max range and aggros a mob; rather then let me know or bring it in, he proceeds to use up his mana on healing himself and we wipe. The next time we fight this group I tell him to bring it in close so we don’t get any adds, and again he goes max range and waists all his mana on healing himself. After this I said the group was done; we had died about 5 times now, and it was late. Well, after saying this, my buddy immediately leaves the group. I let him know again why I was telling him these things, and he proceeds to start going off on me about how I think I know everything, that I was blaming everything on him, and that he was just trying to have fun and I make it more like a job. I tried to explain that dying to me isn’t fun, and that I was only trying to give him advice to better his game, but he then leaves the guild and sends me back the gold I had given him. Later his girlfriend logs on and gives me back all the gold I gave her. This is the second time my buddy has blown up at me because of WoW; the last time was because I didn’t help him enough. Now my question is: first, was my advice bad, second, was I too hard on him and third, has anyone else ever had problems with real life friends on WoW and if so how did you deal with them. Should I just keep my mouth shut because he’s my buddy, or should I be able to criticize his play style in order to help him better his game? I disbanded the guild, and later that night we patched things up and he asked to come back to the guild. He didn’t seem happy that I deleted it; did I over react? Any input about this situation would be nice considering he’s the only other person I know who plays WoW, and everyone else wouldn’t understand how this was even an issue.

[moopy]

Yep, I had some problems with my brother while he was learning the ropes. It took him ages to understand the concept that I wanted to pull mobs to a safe place and within totem range. Later, when he got his felguard, it took a lot of reminders to stop him from making it charge the mobs I was pulling back.

However, I did keep reminding him as gently as I could (sometimes I got miffed and barked at him a bit, I am sure), bit eventually, he got used to it. When he was off playing in PUGs he only learned the worst of habits- the problem is that I am used to rolling with people with whom I have raided every old-world 40 man in the game. We all understand how PvE works, we all have experience, and I forgot that my bro', who is a smart cookie, simply didn't.

Now he's bordering on slick, and it's nice to see that he has a pretty fine appreciation of stuff like line of sight, aggro and everything else. It just took a while. I maybe forgot how long it took me to get the hang of this stuff.

[Ashenshugra]

He overreacted IMO. Im sure both of you will put it behind you in no time. But in the future get some ground rules established BEFORE you enter an instance. IE: your job is to ........ I think we have all entered an instance with that person.

[DraedynLei]

honestly i gave up reading your post because it got too hard without paragraphs. i dont mean to be critical but you could help out readers by breaking up your post a little. makes it much easier on the eyes.

[Cychwyn]

The advice to go through the ground rules before you start is a good idea, and it is also a good idea to talk it through with *all* the party members so your mate doesn't feel picked on. No need for a two-hour grilling-session, just a quick run through the basics.

Were you the only two (three (gf)) members of the guild? Otherwise a bit harsh to the other guildies to just disband their guild.

You should definitely be able to tell your mates how to improve their game. Sometimes it is better to phrase it along the lines of "Could you humour me and try {blah} this time? I think it will give us an edge on the mobs." but you (should) know how to lessen the drama a lot better than I, with regards to your mates. :grin:

[Penny]

It takes 2 to tango. Friendships exist when there are shared interests and compatible personalities.

If your friendship is being strained, look at how you communicate that you share your friends interests. Do what you need to do to show your personality is compatible with his personality. That part is best described as "give and take". Decide if his friendship is more important than a game and let him know what you've decided.

Or not, that's up to you. It takes 2 to be friends and 1 to stop being friends.

[mesonm]

Maybe wow isn't the right thing for your friendship...

there are many other places and ways to interact as friends.

On the flip side, go into instances that are guaranteed to be won, with a third party leading...(take a 70, or something on that order...)

Let that leader teach him/you, and doesn't make you the bad guy.

[SadaraK]

From the sounds of it, its a situation thats happened because one person who takes wow quite seriously has instances with someone whos just starting out and doesn't see it as very important. If thats the case theres not much you can do, he see's it as a bit of a mess around and really doesn't seem to care about a few deaths in some game. You see it as more serious then that.

Since you can't force him to take it more seriously it might be more advisable to just leave wow out of the friendship. As a presumption i would also say that because he's a friend you are quite motivated to get him into the game so you have a friend in game. While thats a nice goal it can cause friction when your friend doesn't see the game in the same light as you.

[Xlorep DarkHelm]

While I personally refer to myself as having a "Teflon coating" when it comes to relationships with friends (nothing sticks, it all slides right off me), I do find it perplexing that someone would get so explosive over WoW to the point of seemingly breaking up the friendship over it. My roommate, and long, long time best friend and I both play WoW. We both poke fun at each other -- in the game or out of it. We rarely take each other seriously, unless it is something that needs to be taken seriously, and even then, we'll make wise-cracks about it. I say that honestly, some loosening up should be in order, all around. Yeah, dying's frustrating, to be sure. And I would make fun of my roommate if he continued to keep killing/wiping any party we were in. I'd not necessarily make it publicly-viewable, just whispers between each other, or more likely simply telling him in person. My guess is, if you ere criticizing his play-style in front of other people, he might have gotten upset at that.

[Fundin]

I have had this exact situation ... maybe still *am* having it. A few of my friends started playing recently. I've been playing a long time, have a 70 and another pre-BC 60 well on the way to 70 and numerous alts. They want help all the time and when I do help them (with alts or main), they exhibit pretty horrible play. Please note: this is *completely* understandable. I'm sure we all remember having no idea what the heck we were doing in that "instance" thingy.

Anyway, rather than correct them again and again (of course I try gently a few times), I've had a better idea. I stay "busy" with my level 70 guildies a lot and basically force these guys to PUG it up. Now, I know they can learn some bad habits from PUGs, but I also know that when they do something exceptionally stupid, someone is going to yell at them. They've even gotten kicked from groups for blowing it multiple times. The beauty is they need to be yelled at and I don't have to do it. I've noticed marked improvement in grouping with them since employing this new "tactic". They're learning the basics somewhere just like we all did on the first time around.

Best of luck in resolving all this, but if you continue having problems with RL friends because of the game, you have to sacrifice something in game to save that friendship IMO. Real friends are simply more important.

- Fundin

[Martineau]

This is probably the best thread I've read on this site; not once did someone say something retarded, and all feedback was great.

Next time I'll spread the post out a bit so its not so cluttered.

And just a note, the guild we were in was just a three person one; we had just started it. And lastly, I know my buddy and I will be fine, and we've already agreed that our playing styles are a bit different. He enjoys the grouping aspect of the game; being able to chat with friends while playing a game, while I like the actual content and working as a team to work through it. I'm sure after a while we'll figure out some middle ground, but for now I just needed to know if there was anything that could have been done different; now I know.

Thanks for the info!

[rgirty]

I’ve been playing WoW now for about two and a half years, and my buddy has been playing for about a year now. We recently rolled some Horde characters on The Underbog and have been leveling then through quests up until last night. Last night we ran our first instance together with these characters, Wailing Caverns, and things didn’t go so good. We were running the instance with a 23 feral druid (me), a 22 priest (my buddy), and a 22 rogue; I thought this would be enough to run WC considering I’ve ran the instance with just a druid and a rogue. Well, while fighting my buddy would gain aggro on a patrol and rather then sit still and let me gain it from him he proceeded to run around and fear the mobs which made it almost impossible to gain aggro from him. I let him know to sit still and let me gain aggro from him rather then running around, and we continued. Later we’re fighting a group of three, and my buddy is off at almost max range and aggros a mob; rather then let me know or bring it in, he proceeds to use up his mana on healing himself and we wipe. The next time we fight this group I tell him to bring it in close so we don’t get any adds, and again he goes max range and waists all his mana on healing himself. After this I said the group was done; we had died about 5 times now, and it was late. Well, after saying this, my buddy immediately leaves the group. I let him know again why I was telling him these things, and he proceeds to start going off on me about how I think I know everything, that I was blaming everything on him, and that he was just trying to have fun and I make it more like a job. I tried to explain that dying to me isn’t fun, and that I was only trying to give him advice to better his game, but he then leaves the guild and sends me back the gold I had given him. Later his girlfriend logs on and gives me back all the gold I gave her. This is the second time my buddy has blown up at me because of WoW; the last time was because I didn’t help him enough. Now my question is: first, was my advice bad, second, was I too hard on him and third, has anyone else ever had problems with real life friends on WoW and if so how did you deal with them. Should I just keep my mouth shut because he’s my buddy, or should I be able to criticize his play style in order to help him better his game? I disbanded the guild, and later that night we patched things up and he asked to come back to the guild. He didn’t seem happy that I deleted it; did I over react? Any input about this situation would be nice considering he’s the only other person I know who plays WoW, and everyone else wouldn’t understand how this was even an issue.

I have a friend that got me started playing wow, that being said we have grouped a total of 4 times. We don't get along in game, at all. It really is strange because we have known each other and been good friends for years outside of it.

I meet people in game, then they become friends and all is well.

He over-reacted to be sure, and in future posts could you break down your posts into paragraphs? ;D no offense intended!

[Rex Normal]

I assume your friend who's been playing for a year hasn't played very much? or not as much as you? What had he been doing the past year while playing? did he have a main that he maxed out or just several characters that he tried a bit up to 20 and then started a new one? Whatever the case it sounds like he's not nearly as experienced as you were.

I think your first mistake was taking him in to WC with only 3 players. WC is what 18 - 22 or so? never been there so forgive me if I'm off a bit but even if you and your rogue friend are top notch and can run it as a DUO, that's because you both are very experienced and know exactly what you are doing.

Running an instance undermanned, while possible, is very very unforgiving to mistakes. Even if you are lvl 70 and running a few lowbies thru you can run into difficulties if they don't pay attention.

The best thing to do to break in a new player when it comes to instances is to get a full group. In a full group, mistakes are much easier to recover from and learn from.

I think you tried to push your friend a bit too hard. Remember not everyone plays the game the same. You may need to slow down and take baby steps with him, teaching him as you go rather than expecting him to ramp up his game to match your playstyle.

[LucidTaint]

Yeah, I have a similar issue with my friend whom I've known since middle school. My first level 60 was my restoration specced druid. My friend started a restoration druid also, but she levels much slower. Well, I did a lot of 40-man raiding with my druid, all the way up to where my old raiding guild was just starting Naxx when I left to play with my RL friends.

The problem? The fact that I try to give her advice on how to better play her druid, and she gets offended. I try to give her tips on how not to overheal, how to better conserve her mana, etc... and she seems to get angry with me. I'm not going to be so arrogant to say that my way is the only way, but I feel that having had all that raiding experience and being considered a good enough player to have been promoted to officer rank within that guild, that I know a few things about playing my class.

So how do I deal with her without losing our friendship? I kindly give her advice -- rather than saying, "You should do this." I try to word it differently, "This is how I do it." or "This is how I would do it." If she accepts the advice, then good for her. If not, I'm not going to push it -- her friendship is more important to me than this game (hey, I left my guild and transferred servers to play with her and her husband).

But as someone else said, it takes time to learn the game. And some people learn best through their own trial and error. Everyone started out learning how to play the game, we weren't born with that knowledge. So give your friend the time to let it sink in (and I don't consider one or two instance runs "time enough"). And just try to be kind when giving him advice -- we all get frustrated, but try not to overreact. Disbanding the guild was maybe a little much -- what harm was it doing just sitting there?

[PTiger]

This is a good topic because many people can relate to it.

Personally, I decided long ago that I wouldn't let WoW get in the way of my real life friendships who also play WoW. For example, I have a friend who is METICULOUS in how they play the game. They micromanage everything on an extreme level, which ends up taking a lot of time. While this would frustrate me to no end it being someone else, I tell myself that if I'm going to play with that friend, I'll prepare myself for it.

Also this same friend HATES to be told how to play, so even if I have advice for him, I keep it to myself. He's a good enough player not to wipe a group, so I just let him figure things out on their own. And really sometimes it's a good wake up call for me when I do play with him, because we're just cracking jokes and having a good time all the time. When I quest/raid with my guild it's all business, in comparison.

Overall I just let everything slide with real life friends, I don't care if I wipe a bunch of times because I'll just make some money back later for repairs.

[Vulcanz]

umm i just say this never do business with family or friends it never works so relate it back to wow, there more liable to get annoyed over there own mistake that your trying to help fix and then over react.

[Dakiter]

I have a guild in game of all RL friends. Many of them this is there first MMO. I have been playing various MMOs for the better part of ten years so I have a lot of experience in groups and raids and such.

I take them to lower dungeons that they should be doing and teach them the ropes. It is so important to lay down the ground rules. It was hard on them the first two or three times we did it and some did take offense. Even though I could easily run through the map killing everything I still do pulls and explain how to mark targets. I will also explain how the healer needs to control how much agroe she gains and how to off tank adds. Going through this makes them better players.

The pay off comes when I am off soloing and one of my friends will say in guild "Thank you so much Dak! I am in a pug and had to take control after two wipes and we cleared it!" etc etc