Stop this annoying sapping

[OctobersLight]

Ok here’s an issue I feel strongly about and I know there’s others who feel the same way. Blizzard how come Rogues can perform Sap on players (opposing faction) in neutral towns like Booty bay and such?

They can do this with out triggering the town guards into attacking them and they can do this over and over and over and over till you’re so pissed that you want to punch a friggen whole into your computer. It doesn’t cause you damage to be sapped’ however you are stunted for a matter of time.

This can be very annoying when you’re trying to trade, fish, make materials and other things. And rogues I know what you’re thinking already. “I’m stealth so the guards don’t see the attack” that maybe true but they do see me standing their stunted and unable to move and other players can see that I’ve been sapped by a rogue and unable to move kind of not fair right.

Well it gets worse other classes in the game are unable to defend from this annoying attack while in town. If a warlock fears the rogue after being sapped he is attacked by town guards. If a pally stuns with hammer of justice he is attacked by town guards. If a hunter uses a freeze trap he is attacked.

Now all these defensive spells cause no damage to the rogue much like when he uses his sap on players, however the town guards will respond to it and attack you till you are dead and that’s what the rogue has been waiting for.

Trying to annoy you enough that you will finally respond to his saps and then flagging the town guards into killing you. Blizz please fix.

[bubkusjones]

No. Sapping doesn't put them in combat, as it's designed not to. Fear/HOJ/Freeze-trap/etc. are all combat initiating moves. If you don't like it, go somewhere else for a bit, and level yourself beyond the need to go to these spots.

They're baiting you, and if you get killed, it's your fault.

[Kugan]

As bubkusjones pointed out, it doesn’t actually start combat, so the guards can’t pick up on it.

I’m afraid you won’t find more sympathy here than anywhere else (at least not from me).

Is it annoying? Yes.
Is it against the rules? No.
Did you agree that this might happen when you rolled on a PvP server? Yes.
Is there something you can do about it? Yes. Reroll Rogue, or reroll PvE (or follow bubkusjones ' suggestion). If you are unwilling to do either, learn to live with it :P

[Wintrow]

Still... I think town guards should be able to trace a sap. Normal mobs outside of town borders sure, only natural, but town guards are there to stop pestering. Repeated sapping = perstering. Town guards need to be able to spot it.

[Kugan]

Still... I think town guards should be able to trace a sap. Normal mobs outside of town borders sure, only natural, but town guards are there to stop pestering. Repeated sapping = perstering. Town guards need to be able to spot it.

Probably my Rogue mentality beginning to shine through (and I’m not even level 40 yet :shocked:). One of these days I’ll start answering posts with:
Less QQ, More Pew-Pew.

But guards aren’t there to stop pestering (they won’t do anything if you get spat on repeatedly either). They are there to stop combat.

[Clavina]

Probably my Rogue mentality beginning to shine through (and I’m not even level 40 yet :shocked:). One of these days I’ll start answering posts with:
Less QQ, More Pew-Pew.

But guards aren’t there to stop pestering (they won’t do anything if you get spat on repeatedly either). They are there to stop combat.

Agreed, its a GM's job to deal with pestering (if u make a ticket ofc)

[Kugan]

Agreed, its a GM's job to deal with pestering (if u make a ticket ofc)

As far as I know, the harassment (griefing) policy does not extend to the apposing faction.

[bubkusjones]

They'll just tell you it's part of being on a PVP server, like they do with all the high-levels running around ganking the lowbies.

[Nekomata]

The most annoying part about sapping for me was when myself and a few of my friends were indulging in some world PVP - a few lowbie rogues kept sapping us while still remaining unflagged. Now THAT'S irritating. ^_^

[OTHAFA]

Lol, when I hunter's mark a horde, it puts me into PVP mode. Sure potential attack. Same for sap!! STUN with potential attack!

What is good for hunter is good for rogue. Make it an attack!

If I am at Halaa in PVP mode, get sapped by non-PVP rogue! Should PUT THEM into PVP. Others can attack me when they stun, so make SAP an offensive motion.

Thanks

[Wintrow]

Probably my Rogue mentality beginning to shine through (and I’m not even level 40 yet :shocked:). One of these days I’ll start answering posts with:
Less QQ, More Pew-Pew.

But guards aren’t there to stop pestering (they won’t do anything if you get spat on repeatedly either). They are there to stop combat.

I'd have to disagree that town guard are not there to stop pestering. Combat is a main reason of pestering as in "interrupting players who are going about their business", so town guards are a way to protect players without necessitating constant GM supervision. To take the most severe cases away. Only when the guards are insufficient GM's might be called to the scene. Repeated sapping is pestering.

Now sure, constantly /spit-ing on players is annoying too and might fall under pestering as well, but it doesn't interrupt anything you're trying to do so it's a very light form of it. It's tolerable, so town guards aren't needed to respond to that.

Aaah, the delight of "Normal" Servers :smile:.

[xDarkDrifterx]

My opinon:

http://wow.incgamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=405033

Basically, I think it should be added to the guards threat list in some fahion, unless I'm on my rogue, then I say - no way, its working fine! lol =)

______


Rogues sapping in towns makes young hunters learn to keep their pets on passive lol

[Zendarin]

The most annoying part about sapping for me was when myself and a few of my friends were indulging in some world PVP - a few lowbie rogues kept sapping us while still remaining unflagged. Now THAT'S irritating. ^_^

Hey if that's true it's awesome. I can go SAP horde while they are trying to quest and it doesn't flag me for PVP? Talk about the ultimate crime. Wait till they attack then stealth and SAP em... meanwhile they get spanked by the mob :)

That is just plain sinister and appeals to my rogueish nature - but I am probly too nice a guy to actually do it unless they do something to grief me first (such as stealing my mining nodes or something like that).

[Shellar]

meanwhile they get spanked by the mob :)
A single hit will put them out of sap.

[bubkusjones]

And you can't sap them if they're in combat, or is that just for mobs?

[moopy]

Aaah, the delight of "Normal" Servers :smile:.

I've recently seen the need for PvE servers. We copied a load of characters to the PvP test realm- and my GM turned into a monster :) No more the cool, calm collected raid leader- more the gnomish ganking machine.. /shudder..

[MrBCorp]

Sapping doesn't put them in combat...

Make sapping put the rogue in combat. End of story.

What's the point of letting a Rogue endlessly harass someone in a neutral town? It's like the old Shaman dropping an binding totem trick.

My friend and I were out questing in STV one day when a lower level horde found us and sapped us, alternating between myself and my friend, disappearing after each sap. After several rounds he let out a "kek". He was too low level to actually hurt us or kill us, but that's not the only way to have fun. My friend and I thought it was quite humorous so no problem. He tired in the end.

It should not be possible to endlessly sap someone in a neutral town. As the OP said, locks can't use fear, pally's can't stun, no one else can use their "no damage" abilities on the opposing faction, so why can Rogues?

[Mista bee]

you cannot make sap put the rogue in combat as it ruins it for crowd control (Mobs will know you are there) and means the re-stealth function of it wouldn't work, that is why sap doesn't put you in combat

[Kugan]

you cannot make sap put the rogue in combat as it ruins it for crowd control (Mobs will know you are there) and means the re-stealth function of it wouldn't work, that is why sap doesn't put you in combat

Yes. You just can’t change sap to put you in combat. End of discussion (unless you want it to work when the target is in combat. Then we can talk about it :P)

[Wintrow]

Yes. You just can’t change sap to put you in combat. End of discussion (unless you want it to work when the target is in combat. Then we can talk about it :P)

How about:
If you sap someone it puts you in combat for like 10 seconds, but that doesn't mean you lose stealth. So you can still stealth on. After 10 seconds you lose combat-mode and you can re-sap if needed.

BUT the "going into combat" means town-guards spot you as initiating combat. Vanish is then the only way to avoid acquiring a new body-cavity. Or running like hell.

They can do that. The question remains: do they want to?

[Kugan]

How about:
If you sap someone it puts you in combat for like 10 seconds, but that doesn't mean you lose stealth. So you can still stealth on. After 10 seconds you lose combat-mode and you can re-sap if needed.

BUT the "going into combat" means town-guards spot you as initiating combat. Vanish is then the only way to avoid acquiring a new body-cavity. Or running like hell.

They can do that. The question remains: do they want to?

Considering that combat only puts you in combat for 8 seconds, you want sapping to put you in combat for 10 seconds?

And if you are in combat, why won't the mobs suddenly start attacking you?

And how do you sap a different mob? Do you have to wait until the 10 seconds are up?

Sapping is not so annoying since they changed it to 10 seconds. I've only been sapped once since that change, and it hardly bothered me.

Edit: Sorry, didn't read your post completely. That could work (as in only guards attack you).

[Wintrow]

Considering that combat only puts you in combat for 8 seconds, you want sapping to put you in combat for 10 seconds?

And if you are in combat, why won't the mobs suddenly start attacking you?

And how do you sap a different mob? Do you have to wait until the 10 seconds are up?

Sapping is not so annoying since they changed it to 10 seconds. I've only been sapped once since that change, and it hardly bothered me.

Edit: Sorry, didn't read your post completely. That could work (as in only guards attack you).

10 seconds, 8 seconds, whatever

[Algamonn]

I didnt think of doing this before!

Now I am going to try it out!

Cheers for that!


Alga

[Kugan]

I didnt think of doing this before!

Now I am going to try it out!

Cheers for that!


Alga

It's only 10 seconds. Really not worth it.

It's much, much better to throw people off high places with distract. :wink:

[shundaroni]

Had a same level rogue (31) sap me several times at Booty Bay. Eventually caught him out of stealth, popped PW:Shield (to absorb at least the first hit), and Mind Controlled him. He goes into combat (much to his dismay) and get's one-shotted. I manage to jump in the water, but die shortly thereafter. Still, very much worth it.

[MrBCorp]

...You just can’t change sap to put you in combat...

Fine. Make it flag you for PvP combat. Solved.

[Jhadeyn]

Yes! I agree, make sap an offensive ability that way when you are just about to kill me I can vanish and sap your dumb butt again for another few seconds while I bandage and come back to finish you off. Great idea! Please blizzard, make sap an offensive ability!!!

[det]

Fine. Make it flag you for PvP combat. Solved.

I think it now does flag you as PvP. Lv ?? was killing ppl in Kargath, I sapped him with my lv 48 rogue (inspired by this thread) and was flagged and dead in seconds

[Kugan]

Fine. Make it flag you for PvP combat. Solved.

I'm on a PvP server... so I don't think it will solve the problem (don't know if it doesn't do it already).

You can't sap someone who isn't PvP enabled... so if you are on a PvE server, and getting sapped, it's your own fault.

The issue people are experiencing is the cities (especially on PvP servers) where they used to get sapped for ages. Now with diminishing returns, and sap reduced to 10 seconds, it's not much of an issue anymore.

[SLi]

I think it now does flag you as PvP. Lv ?? was killing ppl in Kargath, I sapped him with my lv 48 rogue (inspired by this thread) and was flagged and dead in seconds

Of course it will, same if you try to heal/rez someone who is PvP flagged.
Been that way for I don't know how long.

(Note: only exception to this rule is in 'safe' zones for your faction, where you can be killed after doing something to a PvP enabled player only once - unless of course you keep doing it)

[psypho]

Ok here’s an issue I feel strongly about and I know there’s others who feel the same way. Blizzard how come Rogues can perform Sap on players (opposing faction) in neutral towns like Booty bay and such?

They can do this with out triggering the town guards into attacking them and they can do this over and over and over and over till you’re so pissed that you want to punch a friggen whole into your computer. It doesn’t cause you damage to be sapped’ however you are stunted for a matter of time.

This can be very annoying when you’re trying to trade, fish, make materials and other things. And rogues I know what you’re thinking already. “I’m stealth so the guards don’t see the attack” that maybe true but they do see me standing their stunted and unable to move and other players can see that I’ve been sapped by a rogue and unable to move kind of not fair right.

Well it gets worse other classes in the game are unable to defend from this annoying attack while in town. If a warlock fears the rogue after being sapped he is attacked by town guards. If a pally stuns with hammer of justice he is attacked by town guards. If a hunter uses a freeze trap he is attacked.

Now all these defensive spells cause no damage to the rogue much like when he uses his sap on players, however the town guards will respond to it and attack you till you are dead and that’s what the rogue has been waiting for.

Trying to annoy you enough that you will finally respond to his saps and then flagging the town guards into killing you. Blizz please fix.


dude, just level up. And even then, that's all a Rogue can really do.

[Greemer]

Stop this annoying sapping
Ok here’s an issue I feel strongly about and I know there’s others who feel the same way. Blizzard how come Rogues can perform Sap on players (opposing faction) in neutral towns like Booty bay and such?

They can do this with out triggering the town guards into attacking them and they can do this over and over and over and over till you’re so pissed that you want to punch a friggen whole into your computer. It doesn’t cause you damage to be sapped’ however you are stunted for a matter of time.

This can be very annoying when you’re trying to trade, fish, make materials and other things. And rogues I know what you’re thinking already. “I’m stealth so the guards don’t see the attack” that maybe true but they do see me standing their stunted and unable to move and other players can see that I’ve been sapped by a rogue and unable to move kind of not fair right.

Well it gets worse other classes in the game are unable to defend from this annoying attack while in town. If a warlock fears the rogue after being sapped he is attacked by town guards. If a pally stuns with hammer of justice he is attacked by town guards. If a hunter uses a freeze trap he is attacked.

Now all these defensive spells cause no damage to the rogue much like when he uses his sap on players, however the town guards will respond to it and attack you till you are dead and that’s what the rogue has been waiting for.

Trying to annoy you enough that you will finally respond to his saps and then flagging the town guards into killing you. Blizz please fix

Dont wanna be rude but crist its a MMORPG with some PvP in it the player that saping are 100% awere that u get agry thats why they do it. Just to piss u off. if they took away all the PvP settings including the saping alot of ppls gonna quit. So dont care thats my point its a game lawl. If they took that away well then its just a matter of time when ppl will whine about nerfing and so on.

[Wintrow]

Dont wanna be rude but crist its a MMORPG with some PvP in it the player that saping are 100% awere that u get agry thats why they do it. Just to piss u off. if they took away all the PvP settings including the saping alot of ppls gonna quit. So dont care thats my point its a game lawl. If they took that away well then its just a matter of time when ppl will whine about nerfing and so on.

Don't take away sapping, nobody suggests that. Just not in supposed Neutral cities where ppl are trying to tend to their non-combat affairs.

[Greemer]

Well it is PvP in the game too so should have some downsides it is a neutral spot that include PvP and i dont care so much about it. i have a 70 rogue and i saping alot just for fun. I have a 41 mage too that get saped alot in Tanaris. Ofc i get alittle pissed but dont complain coz it is a neutral spot u should beable do to PvP things like sap.
If u get cought from sap i suggest they make mages detect magic to a PvP too. I hate to get that stupid spell on me.

[Baboon]

Reading this, I think two things:

- Imo, pvp servers are a complete failure (and yes, I've played on one for 1 year)

why? Because there is hardly any PvP action, there is mostly ganking and 2 versus 1 fights, with only one goal : griefing. Before there were battlegrounds, pvp servers offered some experience pve servers lacked. But after, nothing.


- Blizzard is crazy to allow this griefing

Griefing is not fun. If you enjoy griefing, go see a psychiatrist please.

[Polaba]

Go back at 70 and rape Goblin towns imo. The other day I got 30 people together after Gruuls and we all went down to STV to try and take on ZG for fun. On the way we ran into about 4 horde 70s and killed them. We followed them down to BB and continued to kill them over and over, even when the guards attacked us. Simple, we thought, why not just kill the guards?

Needless to say, Booty Bay belonged to Alliance that night instead of the Steamwheedle Cartel.

And a simple solution to all of this if you feel it's just too annoying:

Sap flags PvP mode. Sap flags combat when used in pvp, but not in pve. Done.

[Ripping]

Cool! i didnt know this was possible im gonna do it on my rogue

[Super Sneaky Steve]

I agree 100% with the original post. Even though I'm on a PVE server I still get sapped in SW going out of the war room sometimes.

Guards should kick the crap out of rogues that sap. Annoying people isn't the purpose of the game and we all know GM's are very limited with how they deal with these problems.

[PlayThemAll]

I love the irony of how rogues are getting bashed for being well rogues.

Cause I've never been feared into angry mobs by warlocks that wont just kill me outright and lessen my repair bill. Or stunned by pallies while trying to kill a mob with the same result. Or anything else... :ponder:

I like the fact that the little guy can get his digs in on a high level toon. It makes the game more interresting and gives the little guy more incentive to keep going.

[Super Sneaky Steve]

Playthemall. You're missing the point. If you're in a neutral town you won't be feared into angry mobs or stunned by pallies as you try to kill monsters.

If you're on a pvp server and are outside the city sap away, otherwise people should be able to turn in quests or go to the bank without being pestered.

[PlayThemAll]

I'm not missing the point. Rogues are rogues, by nature they don't play fair. Just look at their talent tree's.

Neutral cities have nothing to do with player neutrality, only NPC's. You are still at PvP status with other players.

Yes, it can be annoying but if you rolled on a PvP server you voluntarily signed up for difficult leveling.