Need advice re Raiding + Guild

[theseus]

With 2.4 on the horizon my guild has basically disbanded all 25 man raids. Over the holidays we got up to 2/4 TK and 3/6 SSC, now we can't even get enough members for Gruuls.

There is a core of 15+ members who are T4/5 geared and some others who are finishing T4 instances (Karazhan has been on farm for last 6 months easy), these are mostly recent additions to the guild.

Our raid leader and a few members recently quit because the GM and Officers are not focused on PVE, and we have been bleeding members since no 25 raids in the last 3 weeks. Also recently about 7ish of these players transfered their alts to a another server to PVP on.4

Having been around for the last 2 years we are a closeknit group and would like to stay together, either in the current guild or another.

The problem is that there is no Guild that is looking at recruiting 20+ members in the T5 area, and we are sick to death of T4.

After discussion last night after the transfers with the current GM and 2IC, they are willing to step down and let others lead, they would stay in the guild but not "lead".


What would your advice be to myself and the current MT as we look at taking over this role and turning this guild around so we can get through T5 and into T6. Keep in mind the guilds focus is a PVE guild. raiding 3-4 nights a week.

My ideas are:

Demoting current officers as they are more just the 'cool' crowd rather than actual officers.
Having a 'Triumvirate' (spelling?) 3 Leadership style with majority ruling, but probably having one dominant.
Having a much smaller group of officers who are focused on PVE.
Demoting all other guildees to member standing and promoting based on skill gear and attendance.
Removing Karazhan from raiding schedule.
Recruiting and trailling players, if they are good keep them, if not kick.
WWS checks after evey raid (Need a link on how to do this its confusing)

[moopy]

I hate to be a prophet of doom, but I suspect that you'll have a hard time. When things like this happen, the better players start looking around for a spot in a better raiding guild, Their friends/relatives/lovers/arena mates tend to go with them too. When a few key members leave, it tends to help make up folks' minds for them. The people who stay are often the least geared/skilled. Sad but true.

If you're going to "fix" it, you'd have to pretty much assume that you're going to have to more or less start over, functionally. You may retain a core of expertise, but you're going to have to recruit, gear up and train like it was a new guild.

I wish I had a happier answer for you, or indeed a more specifc one, but the above really is my experience.

Edit: One last thing... Guild mergers don't work. They just postpone the inevitable.

[Aerath]

Been thinking about it a bit, but Moopy summed it up for the most part.

There's no way in hell you will get to continue at t5 content the way you want straight away.

You'll essentially be rebuilding a guild from the ground up, with all the trouble and hassle that entails. Getting a solid crew of 40-60 people doesn't just happen overnight and quite a few more members will likely move to another guild and number of applicants will turn out to be duds.

[theseus]

Just an update, we ran Magtheridon with another guild in a similar postion (had started SSC/TK but now doing 10 mans) and it went surprisingly well. We choose Mag rather than Gruuls because it is a more difficult fight for those who havn't done it before.

30% on the 4th attempt, we had to call it due to 3 healers having to log, but the general feeling was that it was a very successful run.

As to the Guild merger comment, agree completely. If you don't fix the underlaying problem then you are just damming yourself again.

As the problem in my opinion was lack of direction for PvE this has been, and is being addressed. What is also good is that we are at a similar level of progression to the other guild, and they have the same expectations re PvE.