PUGs stink

[Tater]

I'm in a great guild but I'm rarely online at the time they start raiding so I'm usually left out. Shame I have a life and can't run home after work and hop on the computer to play WOW all night. I'm so sick of afks, brbs, I've got to log and guild just called Pst'd me for this or that, I could barf. Is it wrong for me to just drop from the group? It took 3 hours other day to run a reg SV and we only did the parts we had to to kill the 3 bosses.

Sorry for the rant, just frustrated.

[elsegundo]

yes. its ok to drop group. just tell them you're sorry it isnt working out. then re-invite the ones that were actually good to your group.

[Cerberus]

What I hate most about pugs are people that leave because their needed by the guild for whatever. I don't care what it is, if there is a chance you might have to leave just don't join a group for an instance. It's really just disrespectful.

There, had to get that out after leveling my alt today, hehe.

I'm willing to give most things a go, but if the tank shows up with 9k HP as fury with a green shield I'm not doing a heroic with him. I allways check armory if I take random people for heroics. In normal instances I make sure people know what their role will be and have the right type of gear for it. If you end up with terrible people that really just never get it right I wouldn't feel bad about leaving. I don't mind wiping a bit as long as people try and have some clue but there are quite a few Donalds out there:

http://www.darklegacycomics.com/104.html

[dwarfenhelm]

sometimes players need to leave groups to help guilds out, ive done it before with a full raid going on ive joined a group in a heroic and then half way through the guild has asked me to help out as a member has had to log early. i dont join groups if i know i have a good chance of raiding but if i get asked by the guild to help i will help the guild before i worry about a pug im in.
but 3 hours for a sv run is really going a bit over the top. i would have prob left long before 3 hours was up no matter if the guild asked me to help or not some things are just to painfull to be part of.

[Morollan]

PUG's vary wildly. Some suck, others rock. Did heroic SL the other day and it was an absolute pleasure. The group all knew what they were doing and how to adapt if anything went wrong. Absolutely flew through the instance.

On the other hand I joined heroic UB at the weekend and left after the third pull on account of the score being 9-8 to the mobs in terms of deaths caused. Tank who couldn't tank more than one mob, healer who couldn't even keep the tank up let alone anyone else, huntard who placed traps behind the tank and didn't shoot his target to bring it to the trap. Rogue who seemed to be hitting people with rubber chickens for all the damage he was doing. And me, a mage, doing more than twice the damage of the rest of the group put together!

[Twoflower]

I'm in a great guild but I'm rarely online at the time they start raiding so I'm usually left out. Shame I have a life and can't run home after work and hop on the computer to play WOW all night. I'm so sick of afks, brbs, I've got to log and guild just called Pst'd me for this or that, I could barf.


it is your choice. you chose "having a life" ( boy i am so sick of reading this. ). Now deal with the consequences.

on a sidenote, a pug is usualy as good as the leader is. i had complete nimrods who didnt even know how to play their class and we still finished the instance cause i took 5 minutes to explain everyone what they are supposed to do, i marked the mobs, i told them the strategies etc. If you know so much better, shine some light on the other players. But probably you were just here to rant.

[Tater]

But probably you were just here to rant.

Yeah, and to hear other funny stories so I don't feel so bad about being p/o'd enough to just leave. I've had some great PUG runs too though... Did SL couple days ago and don't think I took a dmg point from a nonboss the whole run. I'm exaggerating a bit but the tank was incredible for what I've been around. I never had to drop a trap, just sat back, popped trinkets and multishotted away. I was tops on the dmg meter because of it. I've never used multi in an instance before because I'd be dead in about 3 seconds from pulling agro.

:thumbsup: Here's to you Mr Awesome Tanker Guy

[Beruen]

What I hate most about pugs are people that leave because their needed by the guild for whatever. I don't care what it is, if there is a chance you might have to leave just don't join a group for an instance. It's really just disrespectful.

If that were the case, noone would ever join a group. Are you 100% sure that you won't have anything come up, that you won't have internet connection problems, you won't have a blackout? It really comes down to how much of an issue you'll let pull you out of a group, and if you live the kind of life that has many of these issues or not.

Or does it? Personally, I've had to back out of PuGs before despite having the kind of life where these kinds of interruptions almost never happen, and when I did, I tried to find a replacement. And while I've never done it, I've seen people do the 'This PuG is horrible. ummm... "Got to go, guild needs me! yeah, that's the ticket!"' way out of a bad group. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that most of the time people play the "my guild needs me" card, it's just to cover the fact that the group, or one of the people in it, is annoying enough that they want out. To be honest, if the group is having enough problems that the entertainment value is zero or negative, I'm not going to knock anyone for wanting out of it.

On the other hand, even though I usually avoid instances, guild run or otherwise, that's too close to a guild function, I have had what should have been a quick run turn into an agonizingly slow run, to the point that even though I thought I had plenty of time, I really do have to go, and expecting me to stay with a PuG that can't clear an easy instance in a timely manner instead of going on a Kara badge run is rather self-centered.

People having to go during PuG runs is a fact of life. Sometimes the reason they leave is unavoidable and unpredictable. Sometimes, it's just because the PuG is so bad that they're wasting their time. Usually, it's somewhere in between.

[Justinledwards]

Naw guild calling is 99.9% of the time translated as 'You guys suck IMO i'm out of here'.

I love it when the one who says their guild was calling leaves and it all seems to run a lot smoother afterwards......

[teck21]

If that were the case, noone would ever join a group. Are you 100% sure that you won't have anything come up, that you won't have internet connection problems, you won't have a blackout? It really comes down to how much of an issue you'll let pull you out of a group, and if you live the kind of life that has many of these issues or not.

No one is 100% sure, what he meant is that when you know there is a decent chance you won't be able to complete the pug. Basically going ahead with said pug while keeping quiet about the real possibility that you may mave to go.

On the other hand, if you have set aside say 1.5 hours for the run and don't expect interruptions, it is by no means your fault. Unexpected stripper shows up at your door courtesy of your GF or somethig like that!

If there's a chance I may have to go early, I let the group know. Usually never a problem, then again, I tank so they haven't got a choice. :grin: They can go get another tank if they don't like it.

[bloog]

Pick up raids with gear checks!

It's so hard to get an alt in, even wearing full T5. After traveling to ZA it appears everyone but your alt is wearing gladiator ****. 5 Wipes at on the Nalorakk is enough to have the raid disintegrate. You did more than twice as much damage as dps number 2.

[Beruen]

Naw guild calling is 99.9% of the time translated as 'You guys suck IMO i'm out of here'.

I love it when the one who says their guild was calling leaves and it all seems to run a lot smoother afterwards......

Agreed on both counts really. One of my better instance runs was one that started off with me being asked by a guildie to fill in for a player that had to bail. Things started going better, but there were still issues, and other people dropped too. By the time we got done, it was a pure guild run, and a very smooth one, might I say.

No one is 100% sure, what he meant is that when you know there is a decent chance you won't be able to complete the pug. Basically going ahead with said pug while keeping quiet about the real possibility that you may mave to go.

True, but how often does that really happen? Seriously, of the cases that I've seen, "My guild needs me" breaks down to about this:

90% - This group stinks (in that person's opinion), I'm out of here.
5% - This run has taken too long, I need to go (and yeah, I let the group know when I'm on a deadline too).
2% - Someone forgot that there was a guild event when committing to the PuG.
2% - Something actually came up.
1% - Someone was just killing time waiting for a guild event.

Now, maybe I'm biased, because I'm judging this mostly by what guildies say and my guildies aren't the kinds of people that would be this inconsiderate, but seriously, how many people out there are there that would join a PuG when they know that they'll be leaving it soon, without telling the PuG?

I think my point is that even of the people that really need to go, the number that knew that they were going to have to go is probably pretty small.

[Tater]

Grabbed a couple more PUGs last night.

First one was SL and went ok until first boss. Healer died a couple of times but other than that it was fine (except for the healer was getting irritated). Tank couldn't hold aggro worth a crap but we did ok. Finally healer got ticked and left, said connection was bad. After wiping on the first boss and getting an alternate healer, I found a replacement that was in channel for myself and split. 15 minutes later, they were in LFG looking for a replacement for my replacement. I guess he got tired of the tank not being able to hold agro and left too.

Then I did Mech for the first time and I was the trouble causer. I died 3x and one total wipe due to my ignorance. The guys were cool about it though.

[mmorpg man]

had the worst experience today with a PUG. get in a group for stratholme, we all got there and did the first pull then the tank said "sorry I'm out of time". so he left and there we were stuck at the beginning of strat with no tank and basically no way to get to the service entrance to get in a replacement. I sware never to heal there ever again.

[Trakamoocow]

As my tank I have more options in PUGs. If the group is going badly, you (as leader) can firstly inform them of the issues (if you know who is stuffing up). If they're 2koolFOsk00lY0, won't understand basic strats (dont AOE break mezzes, let ME hit first, yes im sure my 1k avg tps is horrible for you, etc) you boot them and find a replacement.

Don't be worried/scared/feel guilty or whatever. They are playing subpar for the group (this doesnt necessarily mean lowest damage either, highest DPS can often be the guy screwing over the group!), you've nothing to feel sorry for booting them. As long as you gave them adequate time to prove they simply won't correct their playstyle for the group.

As another dps/healer/whatever (esp as healer) don't be egocentric or arrogant about it, but tell them what's wrong. If it's dps that keep aggroing and dying, just tell them you will refuse to heal them if you see them overaggroing again (actually DON'T heal them, unless you'll wipe the group by not doing so). Repair bills can be an investment in an education.

If the tanks aggro just sucks (more than his gear would suggest) ask him whats up (in tells if you like, most people will get offended if you group debate their tanking sk1llz). If you see a flaw in his tanking cycle (assuming you understand tanking) offer non omglolnoobl2play advice.

Overall though, if it is just a horrible group with nothing you can do to fix it, find another group/go pvp for a while or whatever suits. Don't sit there frustrated for an hour wiping on the same boss. Tell them your guild needs you :p.

[Frebc]

My first ever gruuls run was a pug, and it was great, we had no wipes and we downed gruul. And i won role for my Leg Attachment for a Class.

I pugged Kara couple days later, it went great, unfortunatly we didnt get to prince, we were close, but we didnt because it was 11:50 P.M. and people said they were tired and had to go. But I still had fun and got badges.

[Tater]

Ran 4 more PUGs a few days after my original post and all went super. I even mailed one of the tanks 10G after a Shattered Halls run just because he was so good. I have to say I love running with pally tanks where all I have to do is sit back and pop trinkets and multishot my behind off.

Then came the mother of all bad PUGs. I have been level 70 for a month or so which is a long time for me. I was just starting to do Netherstorm quests since I needed a couple of pieces of gear. So I join the Bot/Arc and Mech LFG channels. Got a PUG for Mech where 2 of the people had just completed one but I could tell they were young kids (which I despise for the most part because they are 2 L33tSauce for everyone else and it's always someone elses fault).

I should've left before we made the first pull. The tank had never tanked Mech or maybe had never been there. He had no ranged weapon and didn't know what to pull so me as the Hunter, started pulling. We all died on the 2nd pull. It was the most pitiful thing I'd ever been involved in.

I'm in an adult guild which has 1 person under 18. I intentionally try to avoid him in game as much as I can because he's the most selfish person I've ever seen. I went on a PUG with him to SV a week or so ago because I joined a channel he was in. As soon as he hit 70, he abandoned the group in SV saying he had to go but he didn't log off. He just continued to blast away in guild chat. If I ever see him in a LFG channel, I avoid that instance even if it's one I need. After he dropped the PUG in SV though, there were no more deaths through the rest of the instance.

[clevins]

Grabbed a couple more PUGs last night.
... Tank couldn't hold aggro worth a crap but we did ok. ... I guess he got tired of the tank not being able to hold agro and left too.

Ok as someone with 2 dps toons i've gotta say this... if the tank REALLY sucks you're screwed... but if you simply out gear the tank and can easily pull aggro going all out... tone it down. Don't start dpsing the second the tank grabs a mob... don't use some of your high threat skills.

With a warrior or druid tank create an assist macro (/assist tankname where tankname is the toon's name) so that you're attacking what they are since they can't easily maintain threat on multiple mobs. Don't multishot/dot etc which increases your threat on multiple mobs. Get and use Omen so you know where you are threatwise.

In fact, what I tend to do with most PUG tanks is to go light at first... if i'm not close to their threat, great, layer in more dps. If I am, stay low.

Yes, the slower dps will mean mobs die slower... but it's better than wiping. And if you really outgear most tanks armory them before you jump into group and try to think about whether you can ratchet it down enough to not pull aggro.

Don't get me wrong - some tanks suck and you'll pull aggro no matter what. But there are ways you can manage this if you're dps and the tank is pretty decent. In fact, the difference between really good dps players and decent ones is the ability to adjust.