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View Full Version : I know I know, duels dont matter!!


Boneshaker
09-10-2008, 05:18 AM
But man Im tired of losing to everything except other Warriors. OCcasionally I have beat a higher level guy but the casters drive me nuts!!.. Tonight my lvl 19 Warrior was challenged 3 times by a lvl 21 Druid. I finally relented and fought him. I was whupping his butt and he was about to fall when he froze me and healed himself and then killed me with some kinda lightning strike spell. I must have challenge me written on my forehead because I never challenge anyone else. Also tonight some guy turned me into a sheep just as I was getting him in a bad way. I couldnt do anything for seveal seconds and he healed himself and killed me. Just venting I guess. :tongue:

prion
09-10-2008, 07:39 AM
its an inherent property of the class at level 19, you simply don't have counters for all situations yet.

semiiramiis
09-10-2008, 02:02 PM
But man Im tired of losing to everything except other Warriors. OCcasionally I have beat a higher level guy but the casters drive me nuts!!.. Tonight my lvl 19 Warrior was challenged 3 times by a lvl 21 Druid. I finally relented and fought him. I was whupping his butt and he was about to fall when he froze me and healed himself and then killed me with some kinda lightning strike spell. I must have challenge me written on my forehead because I never challenge anyone else. Also tonight some guy turned me into a sheep just as I was getting him in a bad way. I couldnt do anything for seveal seconds and he healed himself and killed me. Just venting I guess. :tongue:

How to handle obnoxious duel seekers. You can give in, thereby giving them what they want and only enforcing their behavior. (The rest of us thank you....not) You can threaten to report them (it's an actionable offense, yes, but this reeks of whiny qq enough.) Or you can leave their duel request open on your screen, ignore it, and go on about your day. This makes them unable to request a duel from anyone else for quite awhile, and may get the point across. Can't stand looking at it? Go get a soda. Use the bathroom. Peruse your latest copy of PC Gamer.

Twoflower
09-10-2008, 02:39 PM
as much as i hate it, pvp is part of the wow game ^^

better start to practice sooner than later. i made the mistake and didnt, and i still suck at pvp 4 years after buying the game.

On the other hand, prion is right. at lvl 19, you still miss alot of your abilities to counter casters. Later on you will get spell interrupts, infight charge, slow, spell reflection and many other tools which will help you a great deal. so dont be frustrated if there are some classes against whom you have problems right now.

odinsnephew
09-10-2008, 03:30 PM
iirc the OP is a horde player who I am predicting at his/her level to be in the Barrens (apologies if this is incorrect) so my advice would be - Don't hang around Crossroads! The place is a duel spammers Heaven for some reason. Just get in and do your business of repairing, quest hand ins, mailing stuff etc and carry on questing :)

For the record I am mainly a PvP person who doesn't duel ;)

Eileithyia
09-10-2008, 03:46 PM
Usually if I get challenged for a duel and I’m not interested, I’ll just decline invitation and go about my business. If they give any abuse for not accepting, just put them on ignore.

I’m the same as Odin, not one for duels but I am a PVP player. If I do duel it’s usually against guild members, it saves me any embarrassment as I’m not very good at them. (Unless it’s my druid and then its fun as he just won’t die)

odinsnephew
09-10-2008, 03:55 PM
Yep. I guess for me PvP stands for Players versus Players, as fairly generally that's what you will be doing anyway. My rogue can take most players down easily, but enter another player(s) to the poor unfortunate stunlocked persons aid? Things only then start to get interesting :evil:

elsegundo
09-10-2008, 06:19 PM
There are addons that will automatically decline duels.
have tougher skin. just decline and be on your way. if you cant, download one of these addons.

Your Average WoW Player
09-10-2008, 07:10 PM
I think if you ignore someone, they won't be able to duel you. I could be wrong. And if they're so incessant that they MUST duel you, start walking towards a high level zone, that is way higher then both you and the moron. If he follows you, well. You'll get wasted knowing that he got wasted as well, which is a much more gratifying situation.

How to handle obnoxious duel seekers. You can give in, thereby giving them what they want and only enforcing their behavior. (The rest of us thank you....not) You can threaten to report them (it's an actionable offense, yes, but this reeks of whiny qq enough.) Or you can leave their duel request open on your screen, ignore it, and go on about your day. This makes them unable to request a duel from anyone else for quite awhile, and may get the point across. Can't stand looking at it? Go get a soda. Use the bathroom. Peruse your latest copy of PC Gamer.

This too.

And you know, don't sweat getting your ass kicked. You are ONLY LEVEL 19. You don't even have berserker stance yet, which is paramount for doing damage. Neither do you have spell reflect, which is amazing against casters, nothing is funnier to watch then a Mage getting his own Pyroblast in his face, and lord only knows how many other abilities you DON'T have. So don't sweat it. At 19, lemme thing of the things I didn't have on my Shaman...
Chain Lighting (short cast high damage)
Water OR Air Totems
Lesser Healing Wave (short cast heal)
Frost Shock (slowing)
Elemental Mastery (next damage spell is guaranteed crit + no mana cost)
Grounding Totem (Absorbs one damage spell cast at you)
All of those spells for me are Key for a Shaman in any situation of PvP.

Here are some abilities that are Key to Warriors that you're missing:
Berserker Stance (Gained at 30, +3% crit chance, +10% damage taken (=more rage generation))
Intercept (A charge that can be used in combat) (Available at 30, must be in berserker stance)
Execute (Uses all your rage and RAPES a target under 20% health) (Available at 24, must be in battle or berserker stance)
Spell Reflection (Reflects a spell back at the caster) (Available at 64, must be in defensive or battle and have a shield)
I see those used in BGs and duels all the time. Their key. So don't sweat it mate. Just go about your business and ignore the lolz dulerz who need to boost their e-peen.

And as stated, just walk away. Leave it up and walk away. That's what I do. If some moron wants to duel me and I refuse once, I just leave the challenge up and go about my business. If they still challenge you, /ignore them. I'm pretty sure duel challenges can't go through ignores.

drewid
10-10-2008, 01:00 AM
I never request duels but i will always accept them.
It will generally be someone a higher lvl than you or a twink, that will request a duel, they never seem to like being the under dog.
However if like me,you dont have time to play and learn and theory craft every class, then a good way to learn about them is to duel them.

rvalarian
11-10-2008, 05:40 AM
as much as i hate it, pvp is part of the wow game ^^

better start to practice sooner than later. i made the mistake and didnt, and i still suck at pvp 4 years after buying the game.


PvP does not have to be part of the game. there are normal (PvE) realms for a reason. i have spent my entire one-year existence on the normal realms with minimal player interaction and have several successful characters. granted, they are not in über epic gear and they miss out on some content, but they function quite well in their worlds and that is perfectly alright.

---
i have experienced such harassement by mainly higher level players seeking easy kills, repeatedly throwing silent duel flags and chasing me as i decline them. i never accept because as was stated before, it only rewards and encourages their inappropriate behaviour. i have even had to hearth to escape some of them.

there will always be someone who has such little self-esteem that they need to step on/harass someone else in order to make themselves feel good. you have to realise them for what they are and just remove yourself from the situation.

there was a case a few weeks ago on the EU forums where a player of the opposite faction was PvP flagged and deliberately placing himself (6 levels higher than she) in this girl's path everytime she went to do something (on a normal realm) so that she would flag herself and so that he could kill her. she got many cold responses to her post explaining her frustrations and the thread may even have been deleted since i was last there.

the fact of the matter is that it was NOT on a PvP server and though blizzard will not do anything about it because it is something that can be solve through PvP, it is still not acceptable behaviour. the only thing you can do in situations like that is to ignore it and hearth to safety. dueling flags thrown by the same faction may not be a safety issue, but it IS violating personal boundaries when it is done repeatedly after it is made clear that the person being challenged does not want to engage.

NadiaV
11-10-2008, 11:01 AM
I feel that this PvP male bovine feces is going way too far, too. What's even worse is Blizzard's suck-uppance to PvP players. As far as I know, those people haven't paid one bit more for their game than the non PvP players have?

I remember a bunch of uber high level horde players camping Goldshire and killing every NPC the second they spawned. This was also on a roleplaying realm, but the attitude I got was to lighten up and basically stop female dogging about it. So okay.. we have a situation where someone is disrupting game play by constantly killing off low level quest givers. And you get this PvP male bovine feces forced down your throat even though you're on a role playing realm? Blizzard does nothing? Do they even care? But the second some little PvP whiner complains that they're not getting their "honor" points, Oh my GAWD!!! The entire realm system goes off line until the problem can be solved! It's a major crisis! I know noone gives a hoot about me and my lousy monthly contribution to the blizzard money machine. But geez I've wanted to quit that game so many times because of all the inconsistencies. But I guess I have to just accept it's a PvP game made by PvP'ers for PvP'ers and bend over and spread'em. OR find another game. Which sucks because I've played for a long time and have quite a few characters I'm very happy with... not to mention the sharing experience of playing it with my significant other ^^^

Boneshaker
22-10-2008, 05:08 AM
OK IM GETTING A LITTLE BETTER.

I cant seem to escape the guys that want to duel me so I have been working on it a bit. Rogues at or near my level are much easier to beat if I keep moving around THE ENTIRE FIGHT, use Demoralize shout to uncloak them , hamstring and I switch from DW to big 2 hander and I keep hitting overpower. Its like a I WIN button with rouges at or near my lvl.

This one Warlock that hounds me I just cant beat though. I havent figured out how yet. Im only lvl 26 and dont have intercept yet. If I can get a hamstring on him I do ok but his DPS must be great because my health disappears fast with him and he's at my lvl. Everytime this guys see's me somewhere he throws down the gauntlet & its almost funny at this point. Have to figure him out someday.

Druids: Another guy that WAS giving me repeated duel requests is a druid. He used to give me more trouble that he does now. He used to hit me in bear form at first and do a bunch of damage and then root me and change form and heal himself and then switch back to bear form. Lately he's been hitting me in cat form at first and that may be a higher lvl form but I can beat him when he does this. Im shield bashing & hamstringing him as much as I can and when he switches form and tries to heal I hit him & interupt his heal and then I kill him. If he gets his heal and switches to bear form I lose usually. He hasnt seemed to figured out that his bear form gives me more trouble than his cat form.

Hunters, Mage's, Palidan's, and Shaman at or near my lvl can still beat me pretty easily it seems. But Like I said Im getting a little better. The Rogue's that were giving me trouble are not right now anyway..:sunny:

drewid
22-10-2008, 05:23 AM
hmm i would have thought rogues at around lvl 26 should wtf pawn you.

Warlocks i just hate them at any lvl. oh and Druids, hmm and hunters, oh dont forget the pesky frost mages, now that i think of it Dam RET pallies....Back stabbing rogues ArgHHHHH!

Gorny
22-10-2008, 05:27 AM
Incomming wall of text:

In PvP, many classes will avoid melee combat which will make defensive equipment significantly less usable, as well as Protection talents.

The warrior is a very capable player killer, a mix of strong offensive and defensive abilties with excellent burst damage. The class has good attack speed and mobility and can close on a target fast, combine this with an essential pvp debuff of 50% less healing on target makes the class very dangerous. The warrior always does damage and does not need to break for mana. The more damage warriors take the stronger they become, give them a healer they are one of the best group pvp classes. Warrior major problem is often to avoid being kited by more ranged-oriented classes or being starved for rage. For this combat controlling abilities such as Hamstring and Intercept are excellent remedies, also the simple array of abilites means damage can be maintained even with limited rage.

These are general guidelines for PvP warriors.

Always have battle shout applied in any fight - it's a big damage bonus! Although this is open to debate, in battlegrounds most warriors use a big slow 2H weapon, and have spent talents mostly in Arms for Mortal Strike (MS). From the Fury tree you should almost certainly choose Cruelty (+ crit chance). Many warriors takeTactical Mastery in the Arms tree to maintain rage when switching stances in battle which you will be forced to do often.

This setup makes Heroic Strike less useful. It costs half the rage of Mortal Strike, true, but Mortal Strike is an instant attack so is an extra 'free hit.' This is the advantage of having a slow, heavy-hitting weapon as MS is unaffected by weapon speed. Heroic strike gives additional damage to a swing you get. MS also does more damage and decreases the effectiveness of any heals. You will often find yourself with extra rage to 'dump' on your target while MS is cooling down. If this is the case, use it carefully, and always save enough so as soon as MS comes off cooldown you can hit your target with another big shot.

The use of heroic strike however does varry, if used correct and timed with Mortal Strike can double strike your foe. Since one is an instant, and the other a free swing attack, they can hit directly one after the other for large burst. This is rage draning though, but well worth it if you can keep it up. It effectively adds a lot of extra damage to your burst caperbility. (May require the aid of a swing timer addon to use this effectively)

Use Demoralizing Shout, Thunder Clap and Sunder Armor if you have extra rage to 'dump'; this may also be where you could use Heroic Strike from time to time. When fighting casters, never use all your rage; you may have to interrupt a spell at any time. Your talent build should comprise of the following essentials: Mortal Strike, Improved Overpower, Deep Wounds, Impale, Death Wish, Improved Intercept, Tactical Mastery, Second Wind, and Weapon Specialization.

Which weapon specialization you take is largely personal preference and has been the subject of hot debate. Mace specialisation now is a direct counter to ressilence since Patch 3.0.2 where it removes your opponates armour constantly, much the same way to executioner.

The choice then is the greater burst damage of Axe/Polearms or Swords, against a higher overall dps on enemies with Mace weapons. The choice is often personal prefferance, and differs greatly on the type of pvp the warrior focuses on.

The patch changes that really apply to warrior pvp are the following abilities:

1. recklessness, retaliation and Shield Wall being changed to 5 minuites, and no longer sharing a global CD. This means they are now pvp useable.
2. Sudden Death A 30% chance to allow the execute ability after a critical hit, this can one hit low armoured cloth wearers and is excellent for pvp.
3. Bladestorm Essentially a warrior version of a BM hunters CDs, you are immune to all stun and CC, while constantly whirlwinding your enemies. It has many, many pvp uses.

Recklessness should be used on cloth wearers and casters, people who arnt hitting you back with melee attacks. It is very useful when combined with execute allowing for gaurenteed critical strikes which can take out your enemy instantly.

Retaliation is best used against melee classes, such as rogues, other warriors and even Warlocks in some situations. It is a very good defensive ability and can force people to keep a healthy distance from you.

Shield Wall Is best used when your caught off guard by a ranged class which is nuking you heavy from afar. Useful for outlasting damaging attacks from enemies when they use their best CDs, examples include BM hunters, demon form warlocks, mages and elemental shamans.
General PvP Tactics

In PvP, warriors primarily focus on:

1. Keeping enemies within melee attack range (and facing the enemy).
2. Proper counters to enemies abilities, or proper usage of ability-attacks.

Against ranged classes, (Mage, Hunter, Warlock, Priest, casting Druid, Elemental Shaman) the major theme in the battle is whether the warrior can keep the target within, or at least close to, melee range. While in melee, the warrior should be dealing significantly more damage to the low armor foe. Additionally, any non-instant spells cast by the warrior's opponent are in danger of being interrupted. If the target is kept within melee range, the secondary requirement for a warrior win revolves around properly interrupting key spells. Intimidating Shout can be used from 10 yards away and will stop the targeted enemy in place. This is very useful for closing the gap on ranged attacker or stopping them from damaging you while you wait for an immobilize effect to wear off.

Against melee classes, (Rogue, Warrior, Shaman, Paladin, melee Druid), the warrior tactics are much more class-specific. The common tool against all melee enemies is Disarm. This ability will deny enemy abilities that require a melee weapon (there are many of these for these melee classes), as well as maximize damage differential in the warrior's favor. The timing of Disarming a rogue is critical to preventing of the rogue's finishing move, whereas against Shaman and Paladin, you just want to get in this move as often as you can. Other than Disarm, increased melee combat means more "swings" of the melee weapons by both warrior and foe, providing more opportunities to use the high-value/rage warrior counterattacks of Overpower and Revenge (Revenge is only worthwhile if stun-talent added, and can be caused by shield-block). These two counterattacks can be the difference if they are used within their relatively small time windows (management of weapons and stances required).
Rogue

Notable Rogue Abilities:

* Vanish (Rend damage-over-time breaks stealth.)
* Stun Attacks: Gouge, Kidney Shot, Cheap Shot
* High Damage Finishing Moves: Eviscerate, Envenom
* Weapon Poisons: Crippling Poison
* Damage over time (DoT) bleed attacks: Garrote, Rupture
* Powerful cooldown abilities: Evasion, Adrenaline Rush, Blind

Rogues deal tons of damage and have lots of ways to control the fight. However since they must get down and dirty with your plate-covered self to do this; unless a Rogue catches you completely unaware, you will have a fairly easy time whacking them down if you know what you're doing and keep your head cool.

Use a two handed weapon and Overpower as much as possible. Rogues dodge quite a bit because they have bunches of Agility which simply makes them dodge. Remember to activate Beserker Rage before you switch to Battle Stance for Overpower, otherwise the rogue will Gouge you. You can use Hamstring and other instant attacks to 'probe' for a dodge. The improved overpower talent is amazingly effective, especially with a slow two handed weapon. Disarm can also be useful against rogues and it frequently surprises them and causes them to move away from you, which is the perfect time to Intercept.

Furthermore, many rogues will attempt to backstab you, or use any other attack through Stealthing, if you get your timing right, you can use a Demoralizing Shout or any other Area of Effect spell to remove their Stealth, if successful, you will have a large step ahead from the Rogue, since it's a large part of their Stun Lock tactics. The 'Second Wind' talent is very good at mitigating some of the damage done to you while incapacitated by one of the rogues stun lock abilities, but keep in mind that it cannot outheal a rogue's attacks. In order to avoid in-combat stealthing try to always have a Rend or Deep Wounds on the rogue.

Rogues' Gouge and Sap abilities are often used to buy them time, either to kill another target or regenerate their energy. If hit by either of these abilities while in Berserker Stance, you can activate Berserker Rage, giving you immunity to these Disorient effects and breaking you free to continue fighting. Since a rogue's lower armor makes it difficult for them to beat a warrior in a straight up fight, they often make good use of stuns and disorients to get in extra hits--by breaking a Gouge, you can often turn the battle in your favor.

Remember lots of the rogue's abilities revolve around positioning and by hamstringing him you seriously impair his ability to maneuver around you and use these abilities effectively. DON'T just stand still while fighting a rogue, run round, jump, spin about on the spot......anything you can do to make it difficult for him to use his incapacitate abilities on you, if he can't stun lock you he has no chance against you. Remember you have the upper hand in terms of damage and armor. As soon as it turns into a stand-up fight the rogue is simply outclassed.

A typical rogue fight goes like this:


First of all, most rogues are going to open up with a Sap(which doesn't do anything, really, except buys them a little time to think.

Almost all rogues are simply going to go with a full stunlock for their opener. The solution to this is to start in Defensive Stance with a sword and shield to mitigate their damage. You can't do anything about the stuns. Do NOT trinket out of a stun in a one-on-one duel vs a rogue, because you are liable to eat a full-duration Blind which you can do nothing about while the rogue does something to regain health, re-stealths, and in that case he gives himself the advantage.

For the rogue, it's a race to do as much damage as possible before you start laying the huge hits down, which means that they're very likely to blow their cooldowns fast. After the Kidney Shot fades he'll likely pop Evasion to avoid hamstrings (you can't parry or block a blow from behind) and hits for a precious few seconds more.

Despite what many rogues think, using Evasion is NOT instant death vs warriors, unless the rogue has a remarkably low health pool. They will eat one overpower crit (even an Enrage-proc'ed warrior will not overpower-crit for more than 2,000 on a decent-geared rogue. Blowing evasion for them means that they will take one huge hit every few seconds then avoid the rest, which is far better than the alternative. In other words, they'd prefer getting run over by a train once than to get smashed by a truck repeatedly.

Once the rogue pops Evasion get an overpower crit in and a Thunder Clap, then immediately switch to Defensive Stance and go into full tank mode. Demoralizing Shout on him first, then start spamming Shield Block and Piercing Howl. I suggest disarming him too, but most of the time that's liable to be dodged as well anyway. I'd also suggest using an Intimidating Shout, but most rogues will save their trinket for especially that, against warriors.

After the evasion is up, the rogue has very few options. They will attempt to Blind you and get away to restealth for a Round 2, but you can simply trinket out of that. Always save your trinket for Blind. They can Vanish, but assuming you got at least one crit in, they'll have at least one Bleed effect on them which make it useless. They can pop evasion again, in which you can just stay in your Defensive Stance and mitigate their damage. If you have a good shield with a very high amount of armor and block (hence, why the PvP shields have ridiculous amounts of armor, block, and raw stamina compared to their PvE counterparts, not to mention resilience), they shouldn't be doing very much damage to you at all unless they're super geared (Dual-weilding Warglaives or something) and you are not.
Warrior

Notable Warrior Abilities (Which you should know):

* Second Wind
* Death Wish
* Disarm
* Mortal Strike


Warrior abilities are a guessing game as to what their talent build is, in order to guess effectively you must base your assumptions on what gear they are wearing as well as what weapons they are using (or by the less reasonable way of engaging them and hoping they will reveal their higher talent tree abilities). In general, a warrior using a two hander will be Arms, dual wielding will be Fury, and a one hander and shield will be Protection.


The most basic rule in warrior vs warrior is: better gear wins. Warriors are one of the most gear-dependant classes ever and PvP is no exception. It's a DPS race to the finish.

Sword-specced warriors will most likely win against other warrior weapon-specs. The mace-stun might be useful for getting an extra hit in, say, but then Second Wind procs, which just gave the other warrior a healthy amount of rage, and about a HoT worth 10% of their life, which even with a Mortal Strike debuff on will very likely mitigate all damage that the mace-specced warrior is going to do while the other warrior is stunned. And resilence from PvP gear negates the 5% crit that axe/polearm spec grants.

Against a warrior, you just want to start out in a guard mode. Most warriors don't realise this - they simply charge into battle and whack away. Demo shout and Thunderclap, and immediately start stacking Sunder Armor. Stay in Berserker Stance and immediately Berserker Rage so that you take as much rage as possible.

At this point, a lot of the warriors reading this guide will say, "But...warrior vs warrior is just a DPS race, you have to kill him ASAP. Why stack sunder armor and waste rage like that?"

Well, I would agree with you, but there's one mechanism that works to your advantage: Rage.

You see, if you apply Thunder Clap and Demoralizing Shout to them, it cuts their DPS significantly. Less damage dealt = less rage gained = less abilities to use.

Also, if you're not attacking him directly too much (sunder armor does not do any direct damage) he's not taking that much damage either. Less damage taken = less rage gained = less abilities to use.

You don't even need to stack the full 5 sunders on the warrior - 3 is fine. At this point you should have enough rage built up - refresh your Peircing Howl and blow your soft cooldowns (Death Wish, DPS trinkets, and Blood Fury if you're an orc) and open up with a huge sustained burst of DPS(Mortal Strike + Heroic Strike, Whirlwind) using all your saved rage, which should easily match (if not overtake) the damage dealt to you in the time that you were stacking sunders.

Now, you two should be on an equal footing in terms of health, but he has a few stacks of Sunder Armor up on himself, which puts him at the disadvantage. You're in more of a position to win the DPS race now.


Note - I did not mention Disarm. Why? Because for some reason if you get disarmed, you can just siwtch to Defensive and disarm the other warrior too even if you're already disarmed. What a strange game mechanic. In my honest opinion, it's a waste of 30 rage.
Priest

Notable Priest Abilities:

* Power Word: Shield
* Mind Flay
* Holy Fire
* Devouring Plague
* Shadowguard
* Prayer of Healing
* Shadow Word: Pain
* Desperate Prayer
* Flash Heal
* Psychic Scream
* Mind Blast
* Mind Control

Holy/Discipline priests (i.e. pure healers) are usually overmatched by a Warrior, but Shadow priests are a different story. With the ability to jump out of their Fear using Berserker Rage and with use of Pummel to stop casting, combined with high physical damage that is the bane of casters it would seem that Warriors would have an easy time of them, but the combination of the defenses of a Priest (especially Power Word: Shield) combined with respectable damage of a type that warriors cannot mitigate can often make for an almost unbeatable combination. Beating on a Priest whose shield is up and who is draining the Warrior's life from behind it using Mind Flay is the definition of futility: the Shadow Priest can damage the Warrior, but the Warrior is powerless to respond. Nevertheless with a little luck, judicious use of Pummel to stop the larger, longer cast-time heals, and Bloodrage to recover from the loss of Rage while the Priest is bubbled, they can be defeated. As is usual with casters, a Warrior should try to get the jump on them with an initial Charge, fight always in Berserker Stance, and Hamstring them to keep them from getting out of melee range. If possible, it can help a great deal to save non-rage generating attacks for the shield, leaving your white attacks to generate rage when they can actually deal damage. Though the best advice for encountering a shadow priest is just to mount up and get out there if you can - there's no shame in a tactical retreat! You're 95% sure to lose unless you're seriously kitted out, which most of us aren't. Even with only half a health and mana bar they can often beat a full health warrior! A shadow priest is without doubt the warrior's worst enemy, even more so than the mage now - thanks to spell reflect.
Warlock

While you may often lose to a well-geared Warlock because of the heavily beefed-up damage-over-time spells they can spam onto you, which will eat your health away like popcorn, and the fact that most high-level warlocks have health pools exceedings yours, they are not entirely impossible to beat. To stand a chance against a Warlock you can't really afford to make any mistakes, and even then you can still lose if they don't either.

To fight against a warlock is to fight against the clock. The longer you fight the bigger the chance is that his DoT's will eat you up. So keep the initiative and attack him constantly. You can use your PvP-trinket to break his Death-Coil which will surprise most warlocks and still have your fear-breaking abilities ready. Always keep Hamstring on and try to interrupt his longer casts.

Additional notes: Since warlock play styles vary a great deal, it is very important to watch what spells your opponent is casting. If encountering lower damage dealt onto the lock than you would expect against a cloth player, the lock is most likely Soullink specced. If the warlock has a felguard out, he or she is definitely specced for soullink, and 20% of the damage you deal is transferred to the pet. Soullink is usually the hardest spec to deal with for a warrior since you're generating less rage and his dmg dealt to damage taken ration is in his favor. In a group situation such as arena it may be worthwhile to kill the warlock's pet, since they die quickly to focus fire or a few lucky crits. Destruction warlocks, while rare, can be even more deadly to a warrior if the warrior is not careful: Backlash makes for impressive burst damage. Generally you want to only deal physical damage to the destruction warlock when you are ready to finish him.

Other things to keep in mind: Pummel any shadow school spells. This will mean either an interrupted drain life, drain mana directed towards your healer, shadow bolt, fear or howl of terror. These are all spells you do not want him to cast. While this may leave him open to casting fire spells, generally they'll deal less damage and locking down the warlock's shadow school denies him most of his defenses. Another option is to quickly switch to a shield and cast spell reflect if the warlock is casting fear or shadowbolt, and if you are familiar with warlock playstyles you can occasionally reflect a death coil.
Mage

Notable Mage Abilities:

* Blink - instant cast, 15 sec cooldown, teleports caster 20 meters in front of the caster. frees the caster from stuns or bonds (roots)
* Ice Barrier (31 point Frost talent) - instant cast, 30 sec cooldown, absorb next 838 (at lvl 60) damage to caster, lasts 1 minute. While the shield holds, spells will not be interrupted.
* Ice Armor - instant cast, lasts 30 minutes, increases caster's armor by 560, enemy melee attacks have a chance to cause the attacker to have movement slowed by 30%, and attack slowed by 20% for 5 sec.
* Frost Nova - instant cast, 25 sec cooldown, enemies near the caster take 71-79 frost damage, and are rooted for 8 seconds.
* Polymorph - 1.5 sec cast, Transforms the enemy into a sheep, forcing it to wander around for up to 50 sec. While wandering, the sheep cannot attack or cast spells but will regenerate health very quickly. Any damage will transform the target back into its normal form. Only one target can be polymorphed at a time. Only works on Beasts, Humanoids and Critters.
* Cone of Cold - instant cast, targets in a cone in front of the caster take 335 to 365 frost damage and are slowed to 50% of their normal movement speed for 8 sec.
* Frost Bolt - 2.5 sec cast (with talents), deals 429-463 damage, reduces movement of target by 40%.
* Pyroblast (11 point Fire talent) - 6 sec cast, deals 716-890 damage plus 268 damage over 12 secs.
* Presence of Mind (20 point Arcane talent) - instant cast, 3 min cooldown, any mage spell with a casting time less than 10 seconds will cast instantly.
* Ice Block (21 point Frost talent) - instant cast, 5 min cooldown, encases mage in a block of ice protecting them from all forms of damage for 10 seconds and removes all negative effects (stuns, roots, disorients, magic, poison, disease, etc.) Mage cannot move or cast spells during this time.
* Arcane Power (31 point Arcane talent) - instant cast, 3 min cooldown, when activated increases mage spell damage by 30% while also costing 30% more mana to cast. Effect lasts for 15 secs.

Warriors have a good chance against mages these days (it was not always so). Generally speaking you should have no problems against Fire and Arcane mages so we'll be talking mostly about Frost Mages.

Mages are very soft targets so they will naturally try to put distance between you and them and for this purpose Frost Nova and the snare of Frost Bolt are very good. Always keep Hamstring on a mage (also after an Iceblock) and you should be able to run up to him or at least keep him from casting non-instant spells. There are several options to battle Frost Nova. The first is of course your PvP-trinket but cherish its long cooldown. Another good thing to remember is that the mage must be in melee-range to cast Frost Nova so you can easily fear him, making him waste his Frost Nova or his Iceblock.

Intercept is best used if done in reaction to blink, so that the mage cannot blink away immediately in response to intercept and leave you high and dry. Unfortunately, the mage will have to blink first - hopefully in response to a charge you've gotten off. A mage may actually blink *into* you in order to prevent the intercept and confuse you, so be ready for this. Forcing mages to blink before your intercept is difficult, but can be achieved through mace stuns, improved hamstring, fast dps through ice barrier as soon as it's up, or concussion blow if you're a little prot. Canny mages will do everything in their power to avoid blinking until you've used your intercept. However, blink will teleport the mage directly forwards, and if they are blinking out of your intercept they cannot turn to a new facing. So if you are forced to intercept a mage before they have blinked, immediately run in the direction they're facing. Depending on their reaction times and the openness of the terrain, it is possible to be back in melee range before they have a chance to do anything. Keeping the mage hamstrung really helps with this tactic.

Mages will often open up the fight by trying to sheep you. This allows them to re-establish range and open with long casts with no fear of a charge or intercept. Usually, you should just eat what they're throwing at you and save your trinket for cutting down the last few % of health while they try to kite you at the end of the fight, but it is occasionally worth trinketing out of the sheep. If the mage is trying a pyroblast, you will have enough time to get out of combat, trinket and steal the opener with a charge; in these circumstances the mage may even mistake your charge for an intercept. If the mage used frost nova before sheeping you, or you have just come from another combat, you will have enough rage to bloodrage/spell reflect if you trinket out of the polymorph.

Most Frost mages also have an Water Elemental who can do a ranged Frost Nova and some good damage as well. These fellows are very low on health so it can be wise to dispense of them when you see them and get some free rage. However, don't go chasing them on expense of the mage. Additionally most mages shoot themselves in the foot by Frost nova'ing you while having the pet firing at you through the fight, thereby making the Frost Nova's break very soon!

If you're quick, you can oftentimes reflect a mage's heavy nukes or polymorphs with a timely spell reflect. Be careful not to let a mage on low health be polymorphed for too long; cunning mages have been known to throw a polymorph when they know you can reflect it just to regain health and buy some time to let their cooldowns reset.
Druid

If a Druid engages you as a bear at the beginning of the battle he has about 1.5 to 3 times as much armor as you do, so do not expect a quick kill. As with all casters, shield bash/pummel is crucial to fighting a druid: you cannot afford to have them get off a heal or they simply will bleed you to death or tank you down. The majority of Feral spec Druids tend to favour Cat form, which is substantially more fragile than Bear. Note, however, most druids will shift into bear form against other melee classes, making use of the form's superior mitigation and substantial stamina boost. Balance is by far the most effective Druid tree for PvP against warriors, but most of them aren't willing to respec to specialize as warrior killers, so they don't use it (The Moonkin form is essentially their caster version of the feral dire bear form, with equal armor but no stamina boost -- a 'mage in plate'). A Cat form Feral Druid is unlikely to cause you significant problems, unless he is well geared or very smart. However, once Druids gain their level 62 skill Maim, they earn some of the stun-lock capabilities of a rogue and Cat druids become significantly more difficult to kill, as they can now stun, heal, and climb behind you for major burst damage at the middle to end of the battle. Druids will often open in cat form, seeking to keep you stunlocked and stacking as many bleeds as possible before shifting into bear form for the long-haul. If you suspect a druid is nearby, don't hesitate to use aoe's to break his stealth and deny early control of the fight. Though only one bleed is dependent upon stealth (Pounce), you will make it more difficult for him to build up combo points with relative immunity. In the worst case, if you are caught off-guard, it is preferable to eat the three- to four second stun duration than to trinket it and risk losing any possible chance of interrupting a heal.

Things to watch out for: druids have the ability to stun you for a few seconds, either utilizing Bash in bear form or Maim in cat form. Expect them to use this as they are getting low in hitpoints. They stun you, change back to caster, heal, then shift back to bear. To counter this, make sure you are in berserker stance (ideally have your rank 2 PvP trinket for breaking stun ready and equipped). When they stun you, hit your trinket. When their hands turn green as they begin to case heal ... pummel them to stop the heal. Blood rage if necessary to get the rage for this, as that heal will likely mean death for you. Also if you are MS spec, keep that on them, that 50% healing reduction goes a LONG way in winning the battle as druids have several Heal Over Time spells, that your MS will nicely gimp. Another classic trick is to cast cyclone giving them ample time to heal. This can be prevented by using trinket to break the cyclone, then pummel his attempted heal. You can be sure hes gonna heal if he casts cyclone or entangling roots so get you finger on that pummel button! Remember to interrupt his Cyclones as they are easy to spot. Note that even if you trinket out of entangling roots or a cyclone, most druids of any spec will have spent one point on Nature's Grasp, which is an instant-cast spell with a minimum 35% chance to passively proc entangling roots. Do not be surprised if upon reaching the druid you find yourself instantly re-rooted and beyond melee range despite no visible cast. Your best bet is to hope the spell is on diminishing returns.

Unfortunately, a good druid is always anticipating interrupts and will generally do everything possible to avoid getting into such a 'heal-now-or-die' situation (druids with Nature's Swiftness don't even have to worry about an interrupted heal). One way he will do this is by shifting earlier than you might expect so that if he is pummeled at that point, he will still have at least one more opportunity to heal (often back to full). He will usually return to bear form ('turtle') to wait out any spell lock before shifting once again to heal. Even if caught in caster form -- by far the best time to catch a druid -- be aware that he will likely instant-cast Barkskin, significantly mitigating damage even in that form, at least over its short duration (as it has a one minute cooldown, it happily will not be used twice in a normal fight). If your pummel missed, note that normal damage will not cause any spell push-back while barkskin is active. Smart druids will also often feign casts if at all possible in an attempt to get you to mis-time your interrupt, either by self-interrupting or by casting something in the arcane school. With any lag at all, this can be remarkably effective. Furthermore, this all assumes of course that the druid will actually need to heal during the fight, and to heal for more than Frenzied Regeneration will patch in bear form. More often than not, equivalently geared ferals do not nowadays need to top themselves off mid-fight in order to defeat warriors.

As druids are the best class at escaping slowing and snare effects be wary of a druid that get low on health as he can quickly shift forms out of a snare/speed debuff and run away much faster than you can catch him on foot. A good trick against an escaping druid is to continuously using Hamstring and Mortal Strike. The trick is to get the druid into his caster-form where he is a very soft target, and this is best done by causing massive damage to him in his other forms (often easier said than done against the armor bonuses in moonkin and bear forms).

Be careful with druids. Resto druids will die, however slowly, but an equivalently geared feral druid who stays in bear form, or a balance moonkin, can usually take out a warrior without a problem.
Hunter

The advice for fighting warlocks applies to hunters as well, as does the bloodrage/intercept strategy used against mages. Keep in mind that chasing a hunter who is stunning/dazing you is an entirely futile exercise until intercept goes away; switch to a shield, shield wall if necessary, and build up rage on the pet while doing what you can to mitigate damage until intercept recycles.

Another option is to try to get close enough to where you can get off an intimidating shout. If you get the jump on them it's even easier, if not you can still get this to work. Make sure you are targeting them and not their pet, this will get their pet out of your hair for more than enough time to punish them. Most of the time they freak out that their pet is gone so all you got to do is hamstring, disarm whatever you have to do, MS, execute. It's that easy. If they get the drop on you do like he said above, build up rage intercept. That's one of your strongest weapons against the hunter.

One tactic to easily kill a hunter goes like this. If you charge in, likely they will have an ice trap waiting for you. BUT, have no fear. Spamming the AoE taunt ability (challenging shout) as you are charging in, you will likely get it off before you are frozen in the trap. This will force the hunter's pet to attack you, breaking the ice trap, and royally screwing over your enemy. Once the pet has broken the ice trap, you should immediately hamstring the hunter. Next (this is crucial) you should disarm your opponent. But hunters can't do much damage at a melee range, you say? This may be so, but taking away your enemy's melee weapon will take away their single greatest ability: Wing Clip. If a hunter can't wing clip you, and they are kept at 50% movement speed for 15 seconds, you will have more than enough time to destroy your opponent. Many hunters have high dodge-rates so it's an good idea to Overpower them for easy damage.

Most of the hunters you will meet will be Beast Mastery specced. This gives them around 18 seconds of immunity to fear/slowing/snare and all our goodies for keeping them in melee-range. However many hunters have become cocky and think of this ability as a I-WIN button against warriors. Their arrogance becomes their downfall of course. If you're dueling a BM hunter be sure not to stand in the open field, which is optimal ground for a kite-class, but try to find places to hide behind to make him come to melee-range. Most hunters will send their pet against you to debuff and damage and this is where the fun begins. You can use the pet to build 100 rage or you can simply kill it, breaking his Beast Mastery and making him very easy to kill again. My personal favorite is to build 100 rage and fight the hunter head on using every damage-doing ability i got. This is both fun and demoralizing for a BM-hunter who's used to being invincible.
Paladin

From a Paladin's point of view, warriors are probably their easiest opponents. Should you be fighting a Paladin, you can't afford any mistakes. You need to keep them in front of you in order to maximize your damage output, and try to stay behind them to receive the lowest amount of damage possible. Keep them Hamstring and have Rend applied at all times. If you are an Arms spec warrior, Mortal Strike won't do anything for you unless they heal before putting on Blessing of Protection or Divine Shield. If the Paladin puts up any of their "Protection" shields, stay back about 10 yards from them and bandage - this way you should be out of range for their Hammer of Justice and Consecration (which will interrupt your bandage). When the Paladin comes out of their shield, you should be far enough away from them to Charge; a paladin fight is all about rage generation. Without an ample supply of rage to fuel your abilities, you will be easily killed. Paladins are easily the most durable class, but also have the least DPS. They can survive for long periods of time with stuns, invulnerability, plate armor, and other abilities (e.g. Lay on Hands: Restores the Paladin to full health, and uses all their mana, 1 hour cooldown, lowered to 40 mins with talents. This drains all of the Paladin's mana but can even be cast at 1 mana. Luckily, most Paladins use this very rarely, saving it for a critical moment. If the Paladin had to use this to win, consider yourself to be the winner).

Keep in mind that since 1.9, 31 points in Holy tree is growing in popularity, allowing a Paladin to use the spell "Holy Shock", which will interrupt your bandage from 20 yards. Which spec a Paladin is using can often be discovered by looking at their gear: A Paladin wearing a 2h and low mana gear such as BG-rewards are likely to be retribution spec'd or protection spec'd. If they wear a shield and 1h they are either protection or holy-spec'd, the latter being more common. Also, Paladins with epic dungeon gear, Judgement and/or Lawbringer, are very often holy-spec'd.

Notes:

* MS MUST be applied whenever they are about to heal.
* Keep Rend on them.
* Keep Hamstring on them.
* Keep them in front of you.
* Stay behind them.
* Try to keep them disarmed.
* A Paladin survives based on their mana. A Paladin with no mana is a dead Paladin.

Most of the time, if you are able to beat a Paladin, he either made a big mistake or underestimated you. If they ever try to heal without their precious shields, punish them for their foolishness! Should they stun, just use your PvP-trinket, then pummel them immediately. Don't try to do anything else; what you need to do is silence them, not interrupt their spell! Remember, all the Paladin's spells are holy, so if you silence them, they can't use any of their shields, giving you the opportunity to finish them off before they even realize what is happening. (Correction: pallys can divine shield out of silence but a pummel which interrupts a holy spell locks out the holy tree which can not be shielded out of.)

If you're losing (which happens more often than not), there is really nothing you can do other than fight to your death and try to kill them. Watch out for their Hammer of Wrath from 25 yards, if they try to do it either pummel them, stand behind them, or Concussion Blow them if you have it. Your survival hinges on your ability to prevent this killing blow.

Now for the good news: Warriors who spec protection have a better chance of killing any kind of paladin. Shield Slam takes away their seals and blessings (unless they specced deep ret, then you would already have a much higher chance beating them), Improved Shield Bash silences them, and Improved Disarm takes away their weapon (which is devastating for any paladin, specifically ret specced ones which are starting to get popular). Remember that paladins do not stand around and heal most of the time, they do try to attack with their seals. Improved Revenge greatly increases your survivability when you parry/block/dodge their weak, seal-less attacks. If you can bash their heals, silence them and Shield Slam away their buffs, the "immortal" paladin is greatly crippled. Recasting buffs takes away precious time and mana, which is exactly what you need to kill them.

A paladin can't regenerate mana properly without Blessing of Wisdom, and if you take it away constantly, having them recast it again and again and finding out their mana pool is gone is priceless. To top it off, as a protection warrior you have Concussion blow which is usable every 45 seconds. Your concussion blow is not for you to beat on them while they're stunned (that's what improved revenge is for). Concussion blow is your queue to bandage (so prepare a macro for it!). Bandaging for at least 5 seconds every 45 seconds can keep you alive against a paladin for a very long time.

Keep in mind that if Paladins use Blessing of Protection, Bandage as much as you can. They can't stop you unless they remove their own blessing to interrupt your bandage (which they aren't likely to do). In the case of Divine Protection, you may try to bandage, but the paladin might just attack you to interrupt. Best thing you might want to do is switch to battle stance (if you haven't yet) and stay a good distance away to at charge them when bubble fades away.

Shield Slam can take away these buffs (which would generally kill non-protection warriors otherwise):
Holy Shield
Blessing of Sanctuary
All Seals
All Blessings
Shaman

Totems, totems, totems! Shamans depend on totems like Warriors depend on weapons. Bring down the totem and the shaman will fall. This is best done by simply using Hamstring on them, cheap and fast. You should easily be doing more damage to him than he is to you while in hand to hand combat (which, as a shaman, he cannot realistically avoid), especially with you having having disarmed him early on. This will pretty soon force him to resort to healing himself. Interrupt the heal attempt and you are on easy street. Just bash him down. Shaman probably are the simplest (though sometimes not the easiest) fight for a warrior. The formula is always the same - Charge; Hamstring; Disarm; beat him up and Pummel his attempts to heal. You do not really need to do too much thinking, complicated tricks or stance swapping as you would when fighting a mage or a rogue. One thing to look out for is when the shaman drops down to 20-30% and panics. He will then use Bloodlust and spam Lesser Healing Wave which can be impossible to interrupt. Be prepared for this and save your stunning and fear for this moment and quickly nuke him down.

While not a shaman ability, the Tauren racial ability Warstomp is worth mentioning. The vast majority of Shaman are Tauren, so you will likely see this ability used frequently. It can be very effective in close quarters. The simple solution to this is to use your trinket as soon as he uses Warstomp. He will be guaranteed to be attempting a heal when he does this. Just quickly trinket out and Pummel and you will be fine.

Throughout levels 1-50, a skilled Shaman will probably beat a warrior. Level 51-59, Shaman start to become horribly gimped compared to other classes, and you should destroy them easily.. At Level 60+, a well-played warrior should never lose to a shaman, better geared or otherwise.

At level 70, a warrior will begin to have problems with Restoration Shaman. Restoration shamans are near impossible to kill because of Earth Shield, so Mortal Striking early may be a better the solution in order to cut down the heals they get back (as opposed to Mortal Striking when they're lower on HP). Earth Shield is expensive to cast, so the less they benefit from it, the better. Some shamans will try to kite you with Earthbind Totem and Frost Shock, but you'll only have to tap the Earthbind and Intercept before they become helpless again.

In the case of elemental shamans (which have a tad more survivability than that of an enhancement shaman, due to their shield), they are likely to put up Water Shield and kite using the method above. Mortal Strike when they're low to reduce their survivability further(about 60-50% is low enough). Most elemental shamans at this point will stop kiting and try to get off a quick heal. This is your cue to get in there and gib them. If you don't have Mortal Strike, the fight will be a bit harder, since most elemental shamans have the Nature's Focus talent which gives them a 70% chance to avoid interruption when casting heal spells, however you will still be able to kill them easily. The key is to hit really hard, or hit really fast. You never want to allow them one regular Lightning Bolt. If their only form of DPS on you is their cooldowns and shocks, the fight is likely yours. If you have Mortal Strike, save your Pummel for their bolts, not their heals. If you don't, then pummel their heals and try to delay their bolts.

Source: http://www.wowwiki.com/Warrior_PvP_guide

Boneshaker
22-10-2008, 06:05 AM
Wow thats allot to digest but great info. The Rogue info tells me my KEEP MOVING the entire fight method is the way to go. This particular rogue might just suck at PVP but the fact is he used to beat me and now he doesnt. He's probably 9 years old and doesnt get to sit at work and read WOW forums all night like I do.:laugh: