Why Do We Get Customs Charges?

[tylrdiablos]

I ordered a Plushy Murloc off Jinx (as featured on Worldofwar.net homepage) for my friends' daughter for Christmas.
Jinx posted it out pretty promptly and on their order page was a big notice about customs charges and how it's out of their hands... fair enough.

So I get home today and there's a card from Royal Mail saying "Sorry we could not delivery your item because: there's a customs charge".

An extra £11 to my £30 order.

I'm, once again, left disappointed by this "service" and their idiotic staff.
(I'm not blaming Jinx, I'm rather pissed at Royal Mail.)

If something is too big for the letterbox they simply throw it (literally) back in their bag and shove a "Collect it at the local sorting office" card through the letterbox.
(An event I have witnessed first-hand at least 3 times.)
Just knock! I was expecting the item so I stayed home because I knew my letterbox was too small!

So if anyone can shed any light on WHY there's a customs charge in the first place I'd be very thankful.

I'd understand if the item weighed 2 tonnes and required 4 people to move it... but it's a (small) stuffed toy for crying out loud!

More like Royal Fail (http://www.osney.org/po/royalFail.jpg).


Bastards.

[jschild]

Be happy, I've had UPS leave electronic equipment on my driveway in the rain.

[elsegundo]

its a tax. something that every country does. think of it as a 35% tax on your order.

[rgirty]

I had a DHL driver leave my subscription with a local gas station because the person behind the counter said they "knew me and would give it to me".

DHL no longer delivers packages in the united states so I got the last laugh there.

Where I live mail is not delivered to your home, you must pay an annual fee for a tiny mail box. If anything larger than a letter should arrive you are forced to visit the office and obtain a key (after providing identification) that allows you access to a larger box that contains your item.

All this must happen during the hours of business, which coincide with normal work hours such as my own.

In short, if I need to pick up a package I must take time off of work.

So dont' feel too bad mate!

[WatcherZero]

Ahh, here if its royal mail they leave a please pickup at your local sorting office card, if its any other delivery company they usually leave it with your next door neighbour.

Clothing UK import is 12% for cloth, 4% leather 0% childrens clothes, and then add VAT as well.

[Mollymog]

Those stuffed murlocs come from the US, right? That's why there's a Customs charge. You're importing it from another country. You do have a right to complain, though, if they didn't knock or ring a doorbell when they came to your house.

[rgirty]

I've heard something about this vat...why so many taxes!

[TPMdm]

It's customary

[Mazhulsage]

UPS FTW, knock, no one answers, slam it on the ground and walk away. "Not my problem anymore" lol.

[surodat]

It's customary

L. O. L.

That was my favourite pun today.

[MrBCorp]

This makes me realise just how decent the mail system is here in Aus.

I ordered a phone charger from a website and they sent it via private courier. These guys left me a note in my mailbox saying I had to go all the way out to the airport (on the other side of the city) to pick it up, during business hours (something like 8-5 or 10-4). How convenient for them, get it sent here by plane then have it sit in their office/shed until the foolish customer comes to pick it up. Now I always demand it be sent by Australia Post.

Since then I've had some things sent via Australia Post. The item was $65 (or thereabouts) and the postage cost me about $35 or so (from the US). Expen$ive, but at least I didn't have to worry about extra charges or travelling all over the city to pick it up (and it was fast too).

Aus Post delivers it to the nearest post office, which just happens to be up the road from me. 5 mins walk tops. So I don't mind the mail system here. I've even had mail delivered to me when the road in the address was spelled wrong, how good's that?

So if anyone can shed any light on WHY there's a customs charge in the first place I'd be very thankful.

My guess is that the difference between you and me here is that I paid it all upfront first.

[Twoflower]

you are mixing completely different things.

one is the company you ordered from.

two is the company which should deliver it ( the company you ordered it from should hire the delivery company )

three is the country you live in, more specificly its gouvernement, which decides on taxes and custom charges on anything that goes in or out of the country.

now who do you have a grudge with ?

[thorleader]

All of them!
;-)
At my house, the mail doesn't get delivered because the mailman is scared of the dog.
Real useful.

[Wiglet]

*A general moan about Royal Mail*
I now live in a tiny village/hamlet with a village postoffice but its only 5 miles from the nearest big town.

I've ordered plenty of things online including WOTLK and some nice trainers from Ebay.
My postman is a lazy git, rather than attempt to deliver my parcels he just pokes a card though the door saying "Sorry you were out, we tried to deliver your package at 8am please pick it up from the postoffice." which is ALWAYS a load of bull as he NEVER delivers our post before 1pm.
The real kicker is that from 1.30pm til 2.30pm the post office is shut for lunch. :rolleyes:

Ah well the joys of village life

[Mollymog]

I've heard something about this vat...why so many taxes!

It's like American sales taxes, applied at different rates in each state. This is an overall, national one. You'd probably have to pay Customs duty if you imported something from the UK. And I believe you're also supposed to go down to whatever state authority and say 'Hey, I brought this in from another country so I need to pay you the sales tax'.

[tylrdiablos]

Back with the package... which I should probably open and check IS IN FACT a Murloc.

I've been to the local sorting office about 20 times in the past 2 years and there's NEVER been a queue.

Today? 40 of us, in the rain. (Tiny office that holds about 4 people before the queue
goes out of the door.)
Amazing how many of the people coming out of there were carrying Amazon boxes.
(It made me feel special that I didn't have one.)

Apparently if the package is marked as "GIFT" you can avoid certain charges.
Not sure how true that is.

[waflob]

I have had some experience of this, buying stuff from USA and having it shipped to Germany. Basically, the govt says that you've purchased something from abroad and as such is subject to import tax.

It gets worse, as the tax is based on the value of the item, plus postage. I've complained bitterly that the item is not more valuable because it was sent via air mail, but it makes no difference - it is a service that I have purchased.

It get even worse. Not only do I have to pay import tax, but I also have to pay vat on the item, plus postage. The real rub is that then, I have to pay vat on the import tax. All together, for the items I was buying (musical instruments), this added about an extra 30% to the cost of the item.

Ultimately, it's just yet another way the govt has of screwing us.

DelBoy

[TPMdm]

..........

Ultimately, it's just yet another way the govt has of screwing us.

DelBoy

A truer thing has never been said

[Twoflower]

i am glad that you two understand so well how a country is run. You know that you get certain things back for the money you pay to the gov, right ? Like the possibility to buy things from america in the first place. Or the post. Or the streets or the public transportation system which gets you to the post office to pick up your mail. The list is endless. Stop whining.

[mesonm]

So if anyone can shed any light on WHY there's a customs charge in the first place I'd be very thankful.

1. There needs to be someone checking incoming packages so not everything people want to send into the country (drugs, bombs, etc.) get into the country. As a user of international commerce, you are paying to help that check continue to take place.

2. They need to fund it somehow, and you are buying from outside your country's manufacturing systems, and therefore should pay a higher price as a result, to discourage you from doing so.

Pick your poison...

[waflob]

i am glad that you two understand so well how a country is run. You know that you get certain things back for the money you pay to the gov, right ? Like the possibility to buy things from america in the first place. Or the post. Or the streets or the public transportation system which gets you to the post office to pick up your mail. The list is endless. Stop whining.
Gosh - I'm guessing from this post that you've never had a job, or else you would know how crushingly depressing it is seeing how much money goes to the govt just in income tax.

but seriously ...

About half of my actual pay ends up in my bank account. The half that is left gets used to buy stuff that I actually need - i.e. food, rent, bills etc. All of these are subject to VAT, so in effect, we're all being taxed many times over.

Also, the examples you gave are not good ones. If I use the post office service, I have to pay for it, ditto public transport.

There is a reason that for many years, a t-shirt with the slogan "Born free - taxed to death" was so very popular.

DelBoy

[Twoflower]

There is a reason that for many years, a t-shirt with the slogan "Born free - taxed to death" was so very popular.


yes there is a reason for that. people are ignorant and take everything for granted when they had it for more than a few years. Public services dont grow on trees, and you certainly know that.

even though there are differences in the actual amount of what gets taken away from your paycheck between countries, it boils down to the same. All european countries provide more or less the same service from your taxes. I dont have to remind you that you aswell profit from the education system, the health care, the social security etc ?

Only because these things have been working more or less properly for a few years does not mean that they are granted, or that they dont need money to be up to date.

It is so blatantly obvious, do we realy need to have this discussion ?

[MrBCorp]

Ok now I know why I was getting confused. In Australia, unless the item(s) is worth $1000 or over, you don't pay a customs charge.

[rgirty]

As far as taxes go, I can't speak for people in europe. I can only speak as an american.

I feel that our money isn't spent wisely by the government. I'm hoping the new administration will see things a little differently than the current one but only time will tell.

I would be happy if we would:

A. Stop invading other countries and shooting people in the name of defense, unless there really is a valid reason behind it.

B. A national health care system so that people can get the care they need without paying insane amounts of $ to insurance companies or going without care.

C. Some sort of actual working food and public education program. Both have serious issues. College tuition is beginning to reach the point where it may be unavailable to a good portion of society and those that can attend will have a huge burden of debt when they emerge with a degree.

I realize that government really isn't there to take care of you, but if it isn't it should stop taking such a large portion of our $ to pretend that it is what it is doing.

With all the bailouts, mortgage issues, corruption issues and loss of 401k savings I'm truly afraid that we are on the verge of some desperate times.

[Twoflower]

everyone always has some points where he would like his tax money to spend more how he likes it. Only possibility is to vote different. In switzerland we have quite alot of influence, since we have so many partys to choose from. In the US, you can only choose between 2 candidates every 4 years, so you have much littler choice. But hey...

We still have it good compared to alot of other countries.

But i can only agree with your points.

[TPMdm]

IMO the government should get out of the way of private industry for nearly all the things rgirty mentioned.

I agree with point A however and that would go a long way to saving money ("pulling out now" isn't the right policy).

[MrBCorp]

As far as taxes go, I can't speak for people in europe. I can only speak as an american.

I feel that our money isn't spent wisely by the government. I'm hoping the new administration will see things a little differently than the current one but only time will tell.

Has there even been a government that people did feel money was spent wisely?


You mention health care and I can't help but feel this is one area Australia has it right. In Australia you can go to a hospital (emergency department) and they will treat you. It is illegal for them to refuse to treat you. Even visitors to the country (I think, fairly sure anyway). Sometimes I find it hard to believe that America, the supposed greatest country on earth, doesn't have a better health system.

Only because these things have been working more or less properly for a few years does not mean that they are granted, or that they dont need money to be up to date.

Then of course you have stuff like $10,000 grants to arts students, or other ridiculous things. Not to mention the always over-budget and behind schedule public funded projects (new buildings etc).

Yeah, you could vote for someone else, but some things never change. Not without a lot of public pressure and someone (or a group of someone's) willing to change things. I simply don't believe that a simple "vote for someone else" approach is the best action. You need more than that.

[elsegundo]

Gosh - I'm guessing from this post that you've never had a job, or else you would know how crushingly depressing it is seeing how much money goes to the govt just in income tax.

but seriously ...

About half of my actual pay ends up in my bank account. The half that is left gets used to buy stuff that I actually need - i.e. food, rent, bills etc. All of these are subject to VAT, so in effect, we're all being taxed many times over.

Also, the examples you gave are not good ones. If I use the post office service, I have to pay for it, ditto public transport.

There is a reason that for many years, a t-shirt with the slogan "Born free - taxed to death" was so very popular.

DelBoy

sorry delboy... gotta disagree here.
Postage prices would skyrocket if it werent for taxes. so would public transportation fees. do you honestly think in the US, 42 cents covers your cost to send a letter?

[TPMdm]

sorry delboy... gotta disagree here.
Postage prices would skyrocket if it werent for taxes. so would public transportation fees. do you honestly think in the US, 42 cents covers your cost to send a letter?

Pretty sure it's close. BTW, you know the USPS is not allowed to make a profit?

[elsegundo]

Pretty sure it's close. BTW, you know the USPS is not allowed to make a profit?whether it is allowed to or not really doesnt change the fact that, 1) 42 cents does not cover the cost to mail letters and 2) the government pays the rest. oh and its not that the govt pays the rest, but that the govt has a set amount, "budget" for it.

same goes for public transportation.

[clevins]

IMO the government should get out of the way of private industry for nearly all the things rgirty mentioned.

I agree with point A however and that would go a long way to saving money ("pulling out now" isn't the right policy).

Because less regulation worked so well for the financial industry over the last decade. Oh wait...

We can go to the ER to get treated, but it's a significant hassle and they won't treat, say, the flu (sans life threatening symptoms). That's also what a private enterprise focused system has brought us.

It comes down to 'why do governments exist'? At the most basic, it's to secure the common welfare... we band together as humans because we're more secure, less vulnerable to the vargaries of life. A storm destroying someone's house is mitigated by neighbors helping them out... because next time it might be one of the neighbors that need aid. Governments should be that ethic operating at a scale beyond the neighbor level. What that means is:

1) Provide for defense. If someone attacks you, the government should have a ready way to defend you. By 'you' I'm really talking the nation.

2) Provide for common infrastructure that benefits society. In the US the interstate highway system is a good example - having highways helped trade and transport of good and was a good investment for the health of the economy. Railroads were the same in an earlier age. Now, it might be high speed bandwidth.

3) Mitigate the effect of disasters on communities... short term by providing shelter and food and water, llonger term by helping the community recover and rebuild.

4) Provide health care for everyone at some level. This can get sticky... how much care? what about end of life care? etc... but some level of universal coverage should be available.

Below this level though, we get into specifics and people need to realize that there will always be programs that they feel are useless that are valuable to others. Years ago there was an effort to abolish the National Endowment for the Arts. Of course the people who didn't like the NEA pointed to edge cases and not the support for, say Shakespeare productions in smaller towns that otherwise might not have theater. The cost for the NEA at the time was about $170m per year. I dug up this... the cost for military bands at the time was about the same. My proposal? If it's about the money, let's cut military bands since I don't care about those. Of course the ant-NEA peole were generally pro-defense so they had to tell me why bands in the military were essential. After they went on a bit I just made my real point - they find some things a waste, others will find those same things valuable and vice versa.

[rgirty]

You mention health care and I can't help but feel this is one area Australia has it right. In Australia you can go to a hospital (emergency department) and they will treat you. It is illegal for them to refuse to treat you. Even visitors to the country (I think, fairly sure anyway). Sometimes I find it hard to believe that America, the supposed greatest country on earth, doesn't have a better health system.

Most if not all Emergency rooms here have to treat you. They can't turn you away. They will send you an enormous bill, but they MUST treat you.

Here is the issue at hand with that scenario.

Imagine you have 20% of your ER visitors who are either non-payers (they don't pay their bill, ever) or they are non-documented aliens and the er doctor+facility has no recourse to collect their money from those people.

Do you know what happens? The 80% of people who have insurance or otherwise pay their bills have to pay for those people by paying inflated bills.

From what I understand the average ER visit is around $500 before any medication.

Has there even been a government that people did feel money was spent wisely?

The cherokee nation, but we are a sovereign nation within the united states that most people who aren't from the area don't even know exists.

The cherokee are a tribe of native americans (elvis was a cherokee). With membership and the correct qualifications (based on income) the tribe will assist with housing, education, and food.

All members have lifetime medical/eye/dental care at no cost.

I enjoy such benefits, my family does as well.

However I believe every person in the world should have the option to see a doctor and receive medicine if they can afford it or not. I think this should be a higher priority.

I'm not someone with wealth envy, but I could never in my life buy a yacht that costs in the millions of dollars while I know that children in my own country are without food, or even coats during this winter season.

[surodat]

I think the job of a democratic government today is to concentrate popular power to combat concentrated private power, and work to make that job unnecessary.

Mr. Postman, do you have a letter for me?
Mr. Postman, do you have a letter for me?
From my own true love, lost at sea...

[TPMdm]

Because less regulation worked so well for the financial industry over the last decade. Oh wait...

I'll see your snarky comment and raise you two:
Government controlled retirement is the bees knees right? (Social security ftl)
Government education is purfextion wright? (every year in every school district in the United states an illiterate graduates)

Two examples where it has been proven that in general the private sector does a better job than the government.

[clevins]

You lose. You're wrong on both counts.

Most people consider Social Security and public education as great successes. Go read up on life for older people before Social Security (Which is not a retirement program btw, it was designed as an anti-poverty program). And public education has generally ensured that all kids have access to education. The quality varies a lot because of local conditions, but making sure that kids have access from grades 1 through 12 is a good thing.

How would privatizing either system be better for society? Poor kids who can't pay for an education would do what? Older people who lost their invstments in a market crash (say like the one we're in now) would have what to fall back on? Nothing?

My snark was based in reality and some actual knowledge. Do your research next time.

[surodat]

Poverty rate among senior citizens before SS: 50% (and this is using the definition of poverty as bread and water and no place to live)

Today it's at just under 10%.

And comparing public and private schools is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. There is no kid that know of whose parents don't speak English, have no education themselves, has barely a grasp of the language, and is forced by law to go to a private school.

Soooo....

Make your point a different way TPMdm, because that one made no sense.

[Twoflower]

Actualy, he is right. he said :

Two examples where it has been proven that in general the private sector does a better job than the government.

of course i would rather go to a private scool than to the public one. If you pay enugh, you can be sure that the scooling will be better.

The real question is, though : what happens to those who cannot afford it ?

There, public services do the great job.

[clevins]

No, he's still wrong. He's wrong because he's looking at it on an individual basis and that's not government's role. Public education is a SOCIAL good because it doesn't leave a few kids with a good education and the rest with none at all. The purpose of government education is to deliver a good education to as many children as possible because that's of far more benefit to society than having a few kids get an exceptional education. And I'm merely stipulating that private schools are better than public...

And as already noted, Social Security was never a retirement program to begin with.

[TPMdm]

Make your point a different way TPMdm, because that one made no sense.

If you had a choice would you rather the government educated your children in public school or would you rather you children attended private school?

If you had a choice would you rather have your retirement income taken care of entirely by social security or by a 401k/403b, Roth IRA, etc?

My point is that in those two cases the private sector has done and continues to do a better job than the government. BTW, if it wasn't for the fact that it was run by the government Social Security would likely be shut down because it is a pyramid or ponzi scheme.

And to clevin's original comment I never said there should be no government regulation or oversight. I said government should "get out of the way" (my words) of a few specific things rgirty mentioned (national healthcare, government food and public education programs). So, by all means please regulate the banking industry, keep companies from swindling their customers, and protect the public good. Just don't pretend that you can educate my children, take care of me in my old age and be more charitable to my fellow man better than I can.