Where do you begin when trouble-shooting tech-problems?

[tylrdiablos]

I ventured to PCWorld on Boxing Day to help my friend's daughter find a laptop for University and some WoW.

We found some nice laptops... all out of stock. So we settled on an Acer 5535
(This one. (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B001G7PI1W/shopping-ce-21/ref=nosim))

Yesterday I removed the freeware games that came pre-loaded and then installed WoW for her.

I did the Windows Update and let the machine restart as requested.

Now it refuses to run for more than 15 minutes without crashing.
(Complete restarts.)

I'll have a proper chance to trouble-shoot it tomorrow but I'd like to know where you guys would suggest I begin in terms of finding the cause of the crashes.

So far all I can think of is to check the DirectX version and probably install DirectX 9. (As far as I know, WoW doesn't use any of 10's features.)

The Windows Update DID produce one error. The ATI Drivers were installed (via Windows Update) and after the installation and restart I got an error saying the card is unsupported.
(Then why list it as "REQUIRED"!?)

So I may download the default 3200 HD drivers (if I can find them) and use them instead.



Any idea's?

[jschild]

Never use the Windows "official" drivers. Whenever possible, go to the hardware site that made the hardware and download it from there. Getting newer drivers should hopefully eliminate the problem.

[clevins]

Stop. WHAT crashes? WoW? Or the machine?

If it's the machine, reinstall from the DVD you got with it. Put the machine's software back in its initial state. Does it still crash? If so, it's a hardware thing. Return it. If it runs fine then, uninstalll the games again. Does it still run fine? Then run Windows Update. Again, run it for a while. If you can, find a Windows version of memtest to stress the RAM (the most likely cause of hardware issues).

If it's WoW that's crashing, start by running memtest. On my machine nothing else stresses the RAM and heats the machine like WoW. Marginal RAM could be failing due to that. Then update the video driver. But I doubt this is a driver issue - it sounds more like heat since it happens after some time. Make sure the fan's on, etc...

[Xanethia]

I would start with uninstalling the graphics drivers you installed via windows update.

Then you go to Acer's support site and download the graphics drivers from their site.
There -> http://support.acer-euro.com/drivers/notebook/as_5535.html
You find the drivers in the top drop down menu
"VGA ATI RS780M Chipset Driver v. 8.511"

Install that, and see if the problem persists.

Even though you might be able to find your graphics drivers on the offical ati site, i would bet that they will not support your computer properly, if they even will install.
That is because that ATI custom makes the drivers for the various hardware manufactures, so they support some "brand"-only features.

In 9 out of 10 notebooks that i have had my hands on, only the drivers from the notebooks support site would work properly.
I rarely see the generic drivers from ATI/Nvidia work properly or even install on those machines, due to the requirements of the custommade hardware/software for them.

Other than that, as Clevins said -
What crashes? when playing wow/other games/music/movies etc.
Or will it crash, even if left untouched after having pressed the start button ?

if the latter:
Re-install windows with the recovery cd/dvd that came with the pc (if not bundled, refer to the manual for recovery procedures)
does the crash problem still persist ?
if yes, my bet is on a hardware failure, and you'll have to bring it back for replacement/repair (depending on local laws/rules)
if no, try update windows with the windows only updates (leave all hardware updates be for the moment)
If it starts failing after this step i would look at it as some faulty updating.
if still no problems, go to the acer support site i linked higher in the post and start downloading the drivers from there (they are probably a newer version of those that came with the pc anyway) and begin installing the drivers one by one. (with the annoying restarts between each of them)

If the problem still not occurs, try fire up WoW/game/movie, whatever that caused the crash before and see if it comes back then.

if the crashes occur then, it can still be a hardware problem (the game /movie etc, can initialize use of hardware parts that are not used, whit a fresh start of windows)

if not, then i'll put my money on the graphics drivers that you installed, that overwrote the custom made ATI/acer drivers for your chipset/graphic card.

[tylrdiablos]

Thanks for the replies.

Crashes were during WoW and during normal browsing.


Yesterday we got a replacement laptop (and PlayStation3!) from PcWorld.
They didn't ask a single question or even open the box. Just handed over
the new laptop and off we went.

First thing I did after the initial boot was to launch Windows Update and see
what was listed. This time the ATI drivers were optional so I left them out
and let Windows Update install the security fixes.

Then DirectX 9.0c (November build) and then WoW went on.

It ran fine for about an hour and then the screen went black and required a
reset through holding the power button down.

After the restart it ran for about 20 minutes and then locked up again.


I'm starting to think it's overheating. The battery was extremely hot.

I'll be back at my friends' tomorrow so I'll do the ATI drivers (thanks Xanethia)
and get the laptop used on a table to see if the battery gets hot again.


Any more idea's are welcome.

[jschild]

To find out if heating is the issue, keep a real fan blowing on it while you use it (box fan, whatever) to keep it really cool.

Also, try Rivatuner and see if you can set the fan to 100%, it may not be running at a high enough level to keep it cool.

[surodat]

My brother got that exact model a month ago. The exact same thing was happening to it. We took it back and got a replacement. The replacement is working fine. I don't think that this is a coincidence.

edit: looks like there'ss more http://forums.techguy.org/hardware/768093-acer-aspire-5535-keeps-crashing.html

[AkuuDima]

Hit it with a stick.

If that doesn't work, hit it again.

If it still refuses to function according to your needs, throw it out the window.

Go outside.

Piss on it.

God forbid if it still does not work, use whatever edgy debris that is left of it to murder everyone connected to manufacturing the product.


This post was meant to be humorous but now that I look at it, it seems rather lame and disturbing. Alas it is for wicked!

[PlayThemAll]

Keeping with generalities, go back to the last point in which the machine worked. At that point change only one thing at a time, testing each time, until it breaks. If you change to many factors at once it will be impossible to find the problem.

As the above posts mentioned, I have also had the best luck downloading drivers from the manufacturers sites over letting windows find them.

Good luck

[tylrdiablos]

Couple of updates:

The drivers on the Acer Support site are the same build as the ones currently installed.

The machine cannot be rolled back to a previous working state as:
a: it's only 2 days old and
b: it's never worked properly in the first place.


It does seem to be a common fault with this model of laptop (as mentioned
above) and at this rate it's being returned to PcWorld so she can get a
Acer Aspire 6290g like OdinsNephews and my own.

[clevins]

Yeah, sounds like a lemon. Too bad you had the hassle, but cutting your losses is the right thing to do. You shouldn't need to troubleshoot any new laptop really.

[superted]

This is a major problem with Acer Aspire 5535 Laptops which Acer, PC World, Comet, Currys and

Dixons are all ignoring. It's amazing that so many of these have been sold with this fault.

There is only one real solution, get XP on there ASAP - this solves the problem (you can keep

vista on there too) and the laptop runs smoothly and VERY fast with XP too.

***************
A full VIDEO showing how to do this is here: youtube.com/watch?v=rdfU9TXIAd4

***************

I done this and the 5535 is now (at last) working perfectly.
Hope that helps.