Theft in the guild bank

[lulabell]

Just wondering how many have experienced this.

My guild has recently found out that a member of their guild has ransacked their guild bank of void and abyss crystals and arcane dust. They first believed it might have been a hack but he left a lot of other valuable stuff and also had a message ion his account saying looters mail stuff to themselves.

Needless to say he has been booted and his friend has tried to speak to him but with no luck.

Has this ever happened to anyone and is there any action can be taken or a way to retrieve some stuff?
Its a shame, they have been saving a long time - it feels horrible!

[prion]

you sure he didn't just take it out to level his enchanting?

[clevins]

Well, it's posible his account was hacked or that he just decided to grab lots of stuff and be a dick (you don't need Voids to level enchanting). There's no way to get that stuff back because he was give rights to take it. Blizzard assumes that whoever is managing the guild bank has setup rights so that only the correct people can get at things. The problem is that if you only have one or two tabs it's harder to restrict by tab.

The good news is that voids and arcane dust are cheap to replace if you want to. The Abyss aren't.


PS: If Blizz determines the account was hacked they might restore the stuff.. but not if he just decided to be a dick. Moral of this is 1) setup rights so that only a few people have access to really valuable stuff and have them get it for others and 2) don't put stuff in the bank that you care about.

[lulabell]

Found out his character doesnt need it for enchanting which is why everyone is assuming he has taken it on purpose :( - it wasnt just a couple, it was the lot.

the fact that notice he put on about "mailing it to himself" made everyone suspicious which makes them believe he has mailed it to another character which he has that we know about.
His friend got hold of him but he refuses to claim responsibility but says his account wasnt hacked :S

Makes me not want to put anymore into the banks now if people can abuse it like that :(

[Cattleya]

The best thing to do is be more restrictive in guild bank access. Only one tab should have general access at all. The other tabs should be restricted only to a few trusted people. (You should also make sure those trusted people have fairly good account security. A lot of higher end guilds will require that people will full bank access have authenticators.)

On the tab with more general access, people should be restricted to only one or two stacks per day. If they need more for something, they can ask one of the people with full access.

If you set it up like that, then it's a lot harder for someone to steal a lot of stuff. (The abyss crystals would have been on the restricted tab, and only one-two stack of voids/dust would have been taken.)

Of course, this doesn't help if one of the trusted people with access decide to be a jerk. But then, if the guild leadership is the one stealing stuff, the guild has some other issues to sort out. :grin:

Edit: I also strongly believe that all tabs should be viewable by members, even if they can't deposit or withdraw on the tabs. It can help memebers get an idea of what they can contribute to help the guild bank and also makes it less likely that you will have an officer stealing stuff (since everyone can see if they take stuff.)

[Kodonn]

PS: If Blizz determines the account was hacked they might restore the stuff.. but not if he just decided to be a dick. Moral of this is 1) setup rights so that only a few people have access to really valuable stuff and have them get it for others and 2) don't put stuff in the bank that you care about.

As Clevins said, if the account was hacked Blizzard will usually get the stuff back for you. We had this happen twice when high ranking members had their accounts hacked. One way to lessen the impact is to restrict the number of items that can be removed per day.

If the guy was just being a jerk (and wasn't hacked) you might still be able to get a little revenge. :wink: Just send in a ticket and report that you think his account was hacked, based on the abnormal removal of all the guild bank items and that his character wouldn't reply to any whispers from guild members. Tell the GM that he was removed from the guild to prevent any further damage, but you're still concerned about his personal stuff. They will lock the account until they can determine if it really was hacked.

It won't get your stuff returned, but it will make the jerk suffer a few days without WoW.

Of course, in the long run this will just tie up a GM's time and take him/her away from helping someone who really needs it. So don't do the above unless you really really need the "closure".

[clevins]

His friend got hold of him but he refuses to claim responsibility but says his account wasnt hacked :S

Makes me not want to put anymore into the banks now if people can abuse it like that :(

Um, what? "I didn't do it, but I wasn't hacked?"??


Yeah, tighten up the bank security. But I never put valuable stuff in t he guild bank. It's never made sense to me - I'll share with people, but I see no reason to put things like Abyss crystals in there and have them sit. If you're DEing epics, then use them for enchants for the raid team etc. If you don't raid or whatever, just roll on them.

[Maticus]

This happened in my guild a few months ago. The guy who took the stuff reckoned he let his friend borrow the account (yeah, that old chestnut), and this dude thought it would be funny to take it all. When he logged on after it happened we all asked him what the hell he was playing at and he managed to put most of it back, it was just sitting in his bags, but some of it had been sold...

Anyway, this resulted in us having to restrict access to the tabs to us officers only, which was a real pain, having to go to cities all the time for guildies who needed things.

I guess it pays to remember there are some real jerks out there who don't appreciate how much work goes into gathering these items - or they do appreciate it, they just want to annoy people.

[Mazhulsage]

Honestly, I've seen it plenty of times where guilds are dumb about it and make it to where some of the lowest ranks can get 10+ items out of the guild bank, from ALL tabs, not just the useless crap...

IMO, stop putting access to the lowest people, sometimes it's best to just stick to giving the semi-lower people very little access (One tab, with a max of like 3 stacks per day.) is your best bet.

[Froggelet]

Honestly, I've seen it plenty of times where guilds are dumb about it and make it to where some of the lowest ranks can get 10+ items out of the guild bank, from ALL tabs, not just the useless crap...

IMO, stop putting access to the lowest people, sometimes it's best to just stick to giving the semi-lower people very little access (One tab, with a max of like 3 stacks per day.) is your best bet.


The whole point of guild banks escapes me. The guild I belong to is pretty good and I like the members and have had some great times doing things ingame with them, but the bank generally is full of stuff of which the original owners thought 'Oh, can't use this, it isn't worth much, I'll stick it in the guild bank'. It's the last place I'd look for anything worthwhile. About every month they either auction the stuff as is to members (and few buy), put it on the AH or DE and then sell off the stuff that results from that. So I'm not even sure if a guild bank is an asset to a guild, really.

[clevins]

The main use for a guild bank is to hold things like shards. If you raid you'll have gear drop that no one wants or can use. Someone will DE that, and in guild runs a lot of times the shard will go in the guild bank. Usually this is done with an eye to using those shards to enchant raiders' gear. People will sometimes put profession mats in there etc too. The problem is that guilds often don't specify why the bank's there. After all, you could roll for shards, etc. And I've never really understood why people keep thousands of gold in the guild bank.

[Froggelet]

The main use for a guild bank is to hold things like shards. If you raid you'll have gear drop that no one wants or can use. Someone will DE that, and in guild runs a lot of times the shard will go in the guild bank. Usually this is done with an eye to using those shards to enchant raiders' gear. People will sometimes put profession mats in there etc too. The problem is that guilds often don't specify why the bank's there. After all, you could roll for shards, etc. And I've never really understood why people keep thousands of gold in the guild bank.

Guess my guild isn't doing it 'right'. I think maybe the purpose of keeping a lot of gold is to pay for repairs. Mine doesn't do that - the last guild I was in did, but soon had to ask those over level 40 to pay for their own repairs or it would have gone bust. As I said, I just don't bother with it. But I think you're right: it's the responsibility of guild leadership to make it clear what it's there for and what we should be putting in.

[Twoflower]

you sure he didn't just take it out to level his enchanting?

Where exactly is the difference between stealing and "just taking" ?

[Janfader]

You can set up certain tabs for certain rankings only to withdraw. As many have said, this is the guild leaders screw up really giving that access... In my/our GB, only the first tab is available to the 90% members of the guild. The other tabs are for higher ups... those who need stuff out of them that can't withdraw them - they ask the officers for permission. We also have a website for GB requests.

IMO, members belonging to your guild should have to fill out a GB agreement policy for theivery. We have it and it works well. If they don't sign it and agree to the terms, they don't get access at all and can not ask permission either to acquire anything until the agreement is filled out and approved by the higher ups.

[Maticus]

IMO, members belonging to your guild should have to fill out a GB agreement policy for theivery. We have it and it works well. If they don't sign it and agree to the terms, they don't get access at all and can not ask permission either to acquire anything until the agreement is filled out and approved by the higher ups.

That sounds interesting, what is it exactly, and what's stopping thieves from playing along, filling it out then just taking the stuff anyway? :ponder:

[Janfader]

That sounds interesting, what is it exactly, and what's stopping thieves from playing along, filling it out then just taking the stuff anyway? :ponder:

It starts off with a trust factor. Once they sign it and agree it the terms, they are moved up to a rank where at that rank they can remove up to 5 GB items max. After 5, they cannot withdraw any more items unless they ask a Officer for it.

The guild leader essentially thinks of this as two things.

1. If the toon actually takes the time to fill out the agreement and agrees to the terms... then they have sort of conscience.

2. The 5 items they can take out of the guild bank are only in certain GB tabs. Stuff that were/is not generally cared about - Blue BoE's, recipes, minor mats (no void crystals or dream shards etc... or blue cloths etc...)

Once that toon proves himself to be a good bank requester and to continue on helping in the guild in any way, their bank priviledges move up to like 15 items etc.. I don't know the exact details at this moment. It works very well IMO.

Officers in our guild OPG, really have respect for one and another and the rules of the guild. Our guild bank gets full often enough and its time to ope the requests up to the guildies. We have 5 tabs and all are full. Obviously the requests will be given out those who have followed the guild lines and have taken the time to fill out the GB agreement. I'll see if I can link our agreement...

OPG qoute:

NOTE: Anyone who wishes to be promoted above initiate must make their mark below!

EDIT: Due to the limited responses able to be posted to each topic Use the Last created Post in the GB Forum. (Example the one with Alpha after this one, Beta after alpha, etc...)

Policies and Procedures:

1. If you do not have access you need to send mail to (edited name) in regards to the desired Item.

2. If you do have access you may only withdraw an item specified for your class, level, and profession.

3. No items may be withdrawn for NON - Guild Characters.

4. If you withdraw an item, it may not be sold in the Auction House.

5. If you choose to donate, please make sure it is in its appropriate area if and when designated.

6. If you withdraw an item and it is not B.O.E. (Bind on Equip), then please return it to the Guild Bank when finished with it so someone else may use it if they need it. (some bags are not BoP)

(note: all violations can result in immediate removal from guild)

Thank you for you cooperation,

OPG Officer Corps

[prion]

Where exactly is the difference between stealing and "just taking" ?

it's not "just taking". when i say "he just took it to level his enchanting" that assumes that levelling your enchanting is one possible legit purpose for guild materials.

as already stated, this is a situation where the guild leadership needs to be clear on what a legit purpose is.